This is an old piece but people are still commenting on it so I will republish it with an extensive introduction.
John Engelman is a race realist liberal who was a frequent commenter on the White nationalist American Renaissance. He’s not a White nationalist. He’s just a liberal who got mugged by Blacks several times, the last time leaving him with permanent injuries. He’s the proverbial “liberal who’s been mugged by life.”
As the old saw goes, White liberals are all liberals until they get mugged by a Black.” After that, maybe not so much. Nevertheless, I think he is wrong here.
I do not think agriculture was innovated in Babylonia 11,000 YBP. It would be news to me. I’ve always heard it was simultaneously innovated 9,000 YBP in three different places, though the latest information is that agriculture was actually innovated by Africans 12,000 YBP, starting with proto-agriculture in fencing off fields of edible foods (yes, that is proto-agriculture).
The Indians in California nearly cultivated individual oak trees for their acorns. I told my mother they way they treated those trees and the ground around them and asked her if that was agriculture. She said, “Not really, but it sure is awful close.” Keep in mind that agriculture does not necessarily involve sticking seeds in the ground.
Another fallacy is that because Africans, Papuans, etc. have quite low IQ’s now and are behind Whites and Asians, that this means it has always been way. This is a backwards projection of White Supremacist. “Whites are better now, so we’ve always better!” Not necessarily so! No one knows what the IQ’s of any groups were long ago, and higher IQ’s in Whites and Asians may well be a quite new development far along into the Holocene.
Furthermore, like it or not, Africans truly innovated almost all of the most important aspects of human civilization. Language, fire, stone tools, toys, agriculture, animal husbandry, art, decoration, jewelry, fishing with hooks, sewing – it all came out of Africa first, every single bit of it. When you see a Black person, you’re not looking at some alien species. You’re looking at your oldest grandparent of them all.
All humans came from African Blacks. For some reason, the idea that “Grandpa was a nigger” is insulting to White Nationalists, who go to great lengths to try to show that OOA is not true. This shows the extreme insecurity that lies at the base of all supremacism.
I told a Chinese commenter about this and he laughed and said Chinese people didn’t care if they came from Blacks. He said, “If you go back further than that, we were all frogs. We Chinese are just the latest model.” I told my mother what he said and how it differed from the insecurity of White Supremacists, and she said, “See! That proves that Asians are smarter than Whites. We Whites aren’t all that smart, you know.” I don’t know about that, but we are apparently more secure.
Also although the Out of Africa people left Africa at least 60,000 YBP, they didn’t progress all that much in the meantime, and in fact, they continued to resemble Blacks for a long time. Most of the OOA people looked like Aborigines, Papuans, Negritos, and Melanesians until quite recently. The earliest White man looks like some sort of an ugly freak, resembling an African Bushman most of all. 20,000 years ago, Europeans looked like the Makah Indians of Washington State in skull structure. Go look at them. They look like Asiatics.
A Swedish girl from several thousand years ago has green eyes and quite dark, though not Black, skin. I’m not aware of any important human innovations that the OOA people made until the Holocene that were not made in Africa. Yes, they had arrowheads, but I think Africans had those too. The advancements of the White and Asian man, while impressive, are quite recent indeed.
European Whites have only appeared in the last 9,000 years. All “Whites” before then looked something like Arabs. So in a way, Arabs are “the oldest Whites of them all.” South Indian Dravidians and some odd-looking North Africans like Moabites may also be the remains of the most primitive Whites. The claimed achievements of Mesopotamia 11,000 YBP that the White Supremacists like to harp on were done by Arabs at a time when all Whites looked like Arabs. And White nationalists say Arabs are non-Whites or at the very least are “mongrels” or “off-Whites.” So there.
John Engelman: Agriculture and civilization select a race for intelligence. Caucasians began agriculture about eleven thousand years ago. We began civilization about five thousand years ago. Negroes only adopted agriculture about four thousand years ago. They never developed their own civilizations. They have only recently been exposed to White civilization.
Agriculture was probably developed by Africans before it was developed by anyone else. There is evidence for agriculture or pre-agriculture in Africa (West African Guinea Highlands) as early as 12,000 YBP. You must realize that Africans originated many things that we as humans do.
The next to develop agriculture were the Mayans (corn), the Chinese (rice), and the Papuans (yams), all at 9,000 YBP. The Egyptians and Mesopotamians were not far behind. Africans even had plantation agriculture as early as 900 CE in Tanzania. I doubt if Caucasians developed agriculture 11,000 YBP. Are we referring to Mesopotamia, the Levant, or Egypt here?
Animal husbandry was also developed very early on in Africa. It may have been developed in the Western Sahara before anywhere else on Earth. A figure of 9,000 YBP is suggested for animal husbandry in the Sahara. However, pigs may have been domesticated in Papua around this time also. Animal husbandry was widespread in Africa, particularly in the Sahara, the Sahel and Ethiopia, on contact. I don’t know much about animal husbandry further south, but I have heard there was a shortage of animals to domesticate.
At any rate, the invention of the hoe and subsequent hoe agriculture along with the spear played a major role in the history of Africa. Both derived from the early development of metallurgy in the form or iron. Indeed, the Iron Age came to Africa before it came to Europe. The development of iron metallurgy and the subsequent creation of those two iron tools allowed the Bantus to expand massively all over Central and South Africa in only the last 2-3,000 years.
Africans definitely had civilizations, that’s for sure. Mostly in West Africa but quite a few in the Sahel too. There was even a civilization in Rhodesia. Early European explorers drew drawings of large African cities. Looks like civilization to me. Civilizations were especially common in Nigeria. They had manufacture, trade, agriculture for export, all sorts of things.