Alt Left: Teen Sex Moral Panic: The Erroneous Conflation of the Language and Concepts of Child Molestation to Adult-Teen Sex

ChangeIt: I am beyond convinced that the extreme suppression of an entire gender’s fundamental, basic, healthy desire that 100% of men have in their hearts is one of the primary reasons, if not the primary reason, for the extreme dysfunction of the English-speaking world.

Interesting. What’s bizarre is that we are not even supposed to admit to having an attraction to, say, 15-17 year old girls, although a strong attraction to girls that age is about as normal as it gets for any man.

Most of the Internet argument that I am a “pedophile” stems from my argument that it is very normal for adult men to be aroused by 15-17 year old girls. They’ve even attracted to 12-14 year old girls, just at a lower level. I share these attractions of course. “Lindsay says it’s normal for men to get turned on by teenage girls,” and “Lindsay says teenage girls turn him on.”

That’s the whole argument for me being a “pedophile!” Can you believe that? People have gone crazy.

Now they seem to be saying it’s pathological and sick to even be attracted to 18 and 19 year old women, who are full-fledged adults. I see a lot of comments that 18 and 19 year old women are children (!).

I also see post after post after post demanding that we raise the age of consent. In particular, they want to make it illegal to have sex with 18 and 19 year old women except for people who are close to their age.

The rationale is “their brains are not fully developed.” But that’s bullshit.

They go on to say that the brain is not fully developed until 25, and an amazing number of these psychos literally want to raise the AOC to 25. I shit you not. There are lots and lots of these psychos out there.

I think almost all of these lunatics are under age 40. A lot of people over age 40 seem to have a normal attitude about this stuff. I’m told that in the early 1990’s, adult men and 17 year old perfectly legal girls were considered a normal thing. I say this because of the reaction to Seinfeld, who started dating a 17 year old girl at age 38. She was legal as the AOC is 17 in New York. I believe they are still together to this day!

People also said that this insanity started in the 2000’s, probably at the beginning of the decade. So we can trace the Teen Sex Mass Hysteria back about 20-25 years. I’d like to point out that everything these male cucks and fags are arguing for has come straight out of 3rd Wave feminism. So all you “men” freaking out about this stuff are cucks and homos who are spouting feminist lies about the male sex drive, which of course feminists hate.

All the crap about “minors can’t consent to sex” (which is bullshit), “adults should not date minors ever because they’re children (!),” the notion that a 17 year old girl in the same as a 7 year old girl, the notion that older teenagers are even “children” at all, which is very dubious, and the grotesque abuse of the term pedophile along with fanatics arguing “kill all pedos,” which if taken literally, means they would have to kill 22 million American men, the refusal to consider Romeo and Juliet laws since they “allow pedophiles to abuse children,” and the ridiculous and insane obsession with age gaps and power differentials, both of which are considered forms of sexual abuse. If the age gap is too large, the man is called a pedophile even though the woman is an adult!

This is all down to the insane conflation of child molestation and pedophilia and the language around those two, one a crime and the other a serious and problematic disorder, to adult-teen sex, which is completely different, as we are moving into statutory offenses here, and any sane person knows banging a 17 year old teenage girl isn’t the same thing as molesting a 7 year old girl child!

Also, you can only “groom” little children. The “grooming” bullshit was a phrase used back in the day to describe the process child molesters use to convince kids to have sex. “Grooming” only applies where the person has no idea what’s going on. Children are sexless and don’t even understand what sex is, so they have to be talked into doing this weird sex thing by the molester. The talking them into it part is referred to as the “grooming.”

Teenagers on the other hand are quite aware of what sex is and most have raging sex drives. You can’t “groom” a teenage girl, nor can you “groom” an adult woman, another concept people are throwing around.

Yes, men seduce women and I suppose they even seduce teenage girls, though my experience has been that the girls usually try to seduce the men. These dipshits have conflated seduction with “grooming.” It’s bullshit!

The phrase sexual abuse has been grotesquely abused. Really, it only applies to child molestation of little children under age 13. Even there, long term harm only occurs in ~25% of cases, so it’s even dubious whether there was any “abuse” in the other cases. For instance, in a recent study in Denmark of women who had been molested as girls, fully 50% of them answered:

I don’t consider what happened to me to be abuse!

In addition, it’s little talked about, but some kids literally enjoy getting molested. It’s a lot more common than you think, and this is the source of a lot of the guilt and shame that causes so much damage. There’s surely no abuse if the child liked it! I think we should just stick to the old term “child molestation.” It works just fine and of course kids can be indifferent to being molested or even enjoy it. The term fits well.

Further, the fact that ~25% of kids who get molested suffer long-term harm and others may be harmed for a period of time though they’re over it by young adulthood has been conflated with adult-teen sex. Yep, kids getting molested by child molesters can indeed cause serious long-term harm or even less serious short-term harm.

But the conflation of this notion with consensual adult-teen sex has resulted in the insane idea that teenagers suffer long-term harm from sex with adults. In general, they just don’t. They only suffer harm in societies that tell people it’s harmful. In societies that tell people it’s harmless, no young person is harmed.

I get bashed to Kingdom Come and back for harping on this issue, but my whole position is that we’ve gone insane in this subject, and we need to move back to a saner attitude about it like when I was growing up.

I don’t want to have sex with any of those girls, and I don’t care where the AOC is between 16-18.

I do want generous Romeo and Juliet laws though, and I want to bring back sane sentencing for these often fake “crimes” with no victims!

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10 thoughts on “Alt Left: Teen Sex Moral Panic: The Erroneous Conflation of the Language and Concepts of Child Molestation to Adult-Teen Sex”

  1. A very good essay.

    I know this stuff can seem like shouting into the wind.

    But it’s always good to keep dissident thoughts and facts alive.

    And your blog does that, at least with this issue.

    I hope you don’t mind but as someone who has been concerned with this issue as part of a larger MRA agenda for over 25 years, I’m going to list (in one place) the reasons that this idea that teens are children and can’t make their own decisions (esp when it comes to sex) is pushed.

    Please understand that while I have read about four or five of your essays on this over the past few months (just didn’t comment) I haven’t read everything you have published on this site, so if you cover some of this elsewhere, please forgive me. Here are the reasons both good and bad that Age of Consent notions and, heck, consent (as a concept) and the sexual laws (esp as concerns heterosexual men) have gone so batshit crazy over the past 45 years:

    1) Ever heard of “sexual trade union” theory? This is based on females getting jealous of their younger competition as they get older as well as wanting to ‘raise the price’ of sex so as to retain more of the power and perks that it gives and has given them since they were ‘hawt’ in their teens and twenties.

    There’s also, honestly, some jealousy against the lucky man or boy on the part of older males as well, esp married ones. And never underestimate how twisted a father’s natural desire to protect his daughter(s) can get.

    2) Society has been increasingly cutting off opportunities for teens to do ‘adult’ things and interact with adults in society, esp. adult males (who are all suspected of being pedophiles). Even as the rise of single parent (mostly Mom) homes works to hurt boys, so much mentoring of boys by adult men is either outlawed, discouraged, or disregarded in terms of a need for the maturation progress of boys.

    So as teens are presently considered to be ‘protected’ like children, there are now people who don’t remember even what life was like for teens even just a generation or two ago when they were given more responsibility and power. On top of that, there’s that ‘populist’ brain science BS of how the brain doesn’t fully develop until 25, which is actually being cited in opinion pieces and via activists working to raise the Age of Consent to 21 or even 25!

    These two things explain most of the hostility toward adult/teen relationships on the personal level but not the laws and policies and the people pushing for them.

    3) Feminist consent and “power differentials,” or maybe Critical Theory consent and “power differentials.”

    Feminism has real power in today’s western societies. They control (to the detriment of the world, esp. men) the narratives and policies on many issues such as domestic violence, sexual assault, Family Law, and when they do need political help, can often count on what remains of ‘traditional’ Christians. One of their main concepts is Consent. Now, whether they get or got it from Critical Theory or early Marxism or some other source I don’t really care.

    What is noticeable is that over the decades the concept of “True Consent” has gotten narrower and narrower. This is partly because of how feminists and many other modern people conceive of Power. They find it everywhere (the personal is political), and they tend to believe or pretend to believe that EVERY SINGLE POWER DIFFERENTIAL is harmful.

    Hence why in the past it was ok for a Manager to date a secretary provided she wasn’t under his direct control, but now this has morphed to Managers not being able to date “line employees”, even if said employee works on the other side of the Nation. It used to be ok for a teacher to date a student on college campuses provided the student was never in their class or had completed their class, now many campuses simply ban teachers dating students altogether.

    Why? Age is considered a power differential. Merely being a teacher is considered a power differential. The risk of abuse is too great even if both are adults and one of the reasons for the attraction is the power differential in the first place.

    Basically, modern conceptions of Consent and Power have no boundaries and are all screwed up. I’d argue such concepts (as “enthusiastic” or “true” consent) aren’t even realistic concerning human nature and merely cause harm in the ‘real world’. Thus feminist activists are forever trying to ‘crack down’ on smaller and smaller things that they see as abuses of power.

    4) There’s money and power in it to push these policies. Self-interest, or the interest of human organizations such as “Vice Squads”.

    Old women get to punish old men for chasing teen girls (or eventually just younger adult women, see the 50 year old man called a ‘pedophile’ for dating a 25 year old woman). They get to punish younger men for not wanting to ‘cougar’ with them. Fathers get to threaten or downright punish suitors they don’t care for.

    Politicians get applauded for ‘protecting womyn’ or ‘protecting children’. Cops get more power and money. The Criminal Justice System gets more money and inmates. Feminists get to destroy even more of heterosexual men’s sexual choices and punish more teen boys for sexual ‘misbehavior,’ hence ruining young lives and destroying the male competition to their teen female charges. Government bureaucracy grows. The “private sphere” gets narrower and narrower.

    Anyway, hope this comment is interesting and useful to you.

    1. Excellent! I like it very much! I don’t agree it’s been 45 years though.

      That was 1978. I was around back then, 20 years old and screwing 14-17 year old girls left and right and no one much cared. Few young men went down on charges back then as they were considered “close in age” to the girls. Heck, even men in their 30’s didn’t do a lot of time for, say, banging a 15 year old girl. I think they might get something like six weeks in jail. I forget exactly.

      Further, the cops only acted if there was a complaint from the girl or, barring that, if there was a complaint from the parents. Back then the girls almost ever went to the police about the men they were with, and often parents simply ratified the adult male boyfriends of their underage teen daughters.

      Even several years after that in the early 80’s, nobody much cared about this sort of thing.

      I’m not sure exactly when it started. These people themselves say it started in the early 2000’s. I think that’s right but I first noticed “pedo mass panic” around 1995-98. I didn’t notice it much before then.

      I’m told that in the early 90’s, people didn’t care much about this based on the shoulder shrug to Jerry Seinfeld, age 38, dating a 17 year old perfectly legal girl in the early 90’s.

      Let’s put this hysteria’s onset at 1995 and say it goes back 25-30 years.

      Feminists get to destroy even more of heterosexual men’s sexual choices and punish more teen boys for sexual ‘misbehavior,’ hence ruining young lives and destroying the male competition to their teen female charges.

      In regards specifically to:

      hence…destroying the male competition to their teen female charges.

      Can you explain please?

      1. Hi.

        Didn’t really expect a reply, let alone two, but happy to get them.

        I’ll get to your question in a minute. First, though I will explain why I disagree with your timeline.

        I’m aware of the 70’s and that, for instance, Brooke Shields could be nude for “Pretty Baby” at age 12. I was 10 years old in 1981, so I’m not that much younger than you, though I can’t say I had the wonderful “dating market” you did.

        Far as I’m concerned the “Sexual Revolution” started to end for men in the late 70’s and early 80’s, so I missed it. Remember AIDS? Remember the social effects that had? It certainly opened the door for the reform of Sex Ed to emphasize more chastity rather than simply condoms, and many conservative places did so.

        But there were three other things of importance that happened in the 70’s and 80’s that you apparently missed:

        1) The destruction and/or political marginalization of REAL “pro-pedophile” organizations such as PIE and (by the mid to late 80’s) NAMBLA, which was marginalized from the larger LGBTQ community. This and the “Satanic” and other moral panics of the time led to the idea in the popular culture that pedophilia was everywhere.

        And having largely gotten rid of the REAL threat, it was time to begin searching under the mattresses, and they really haven’t stopped since. Crap, one of the big planks of Q Anon is that many/most /all of the elites are actual pedos, and maybe they worship Satan too. And if you haven’t noticed “Recovered Memory” started as a ‘therapy’ in the 70’s or 80’s, and it was never vanquished; in fact, it’s made something of a comeback the past 15 years.

        2) Edwin Meese. The temptation is to lump him in with the radical feminists and their “War on Porn”, but that would be too simplistic and overlook another thing he did: HE was the guy who pushed the first expansive “child porn” and “anti-trafficking” laws and programs. It was under him that Federal AOC was changed to 18, that he went after porn with under 18’s in it, and made it retroactively illegal. This all took place in the 80’s mostly around ’85 and ’86 but some before that.

        3) The feminist sex wars were won by the radicals. The “liberal feminists” were pretty much run out of the movement and any big positions of power or influence by 1990.

        Nowadays, even the ‘sex positive’ feminists typically shill for not only all the regular AOC stuff, but stuff like “informed consent,” “the male gaze” (the slutwalks that men were not supposed to look at were run by so called ‘sex-positive’ feminists), and sometimes the only real difference is that the ‘sex pos’ believe that under special tightly controlled conditions, heterosexual sex can be consensual and non-rape, and the ‘radicals’ don’t.

        Plus the radicals often want to ban sex work or at least do the “Nordic Model,” whereas SOME of the Sex Pozzies actually want to regulate or even decriminalize it.

        4) Catherine Mackinnon and her radical sex view on sexual harassment had pretty much taken over the Supreme Court and sexual harassment laws and policies by the early 90’s. I was a young man and already I knew enough of the relevant law that I was asking myself if they wanted robots at work as that was what it would take to be “professional.” It hasn’t gotten any better since then.

        Anyway, I agree with you that the modern “war on het sex, and esp underage het sex” really took off in the mid 90’s and grew from then on. But by then lots of perfectly legal 70’s movies (porn or not) would get you thrown in jail as a ‘nonce,’ to quote the Brits.

        Now to your question: I just meant that by using the boys’ normal sexuality against them, they could destroy the boys’ lives by getting them involved in the juvie or even regular criminal justice system, thus preventing them from competing with girls for jobs.

        1. Thx. The thing about the Satanic Panic stuff was that that was all about really little kids, like preschoolers! So, yeah, I guess people were in a panic about child molestation of preschoolers, but it wasn’t something you heard much about. And the word pedophile was almost never used.

          Instead, the far better term child molester was used, and there was a lot of talk about “Chesters,” based on Hustler‘s “Chester the Molester” cartoon series. But the very fact that people could laugh their heads off about a child molester shows you right there that things were more relaxed. No way could you have a cartoon like that now without being brigaded and canceled as a pedophile.

          There was also a fuss about “child porn,” but once again that was porn with small children in it. Most people thought it was really sick. But for a time in the 70’s, child porn magazines were legal and could be purchased at adult book stores in Hollywood and places like that.

          There was also a “Rene Guyon Society,” which had the motto of “Sex before eight before it’s too late,” and people talked about how sick that was. Turns out that the organization was just one guy.

          There was also a lot of talk about NAMBLA, and people were not happy with that.

          Nobody was conflating teen/adult sex with child molestation of little kids. The attitude about men having sex with 14-17 year old girls was sort of that you could do it for a few years like I did – say from 18-21 – but after that, they would start cracking down more and more as the man got older. So we already had quasi and unofficial “Romeo and Juliet” close in age exceptions back then.

          But I believe 35 year old men were still being given say six weeks in jail for sex with a 15 year old girl. People gossiped about it but no one hated men who did this. They were regarded as foolish, careless, and stupid, but generally it was understood that every man on Earth wanted to fuck those girls, and this urge was a typical normal and natural thing. It was just that you weren’t supposed to act on it. Men were expected to control themselves around those girls!

          I knew a 15 and 16 year punker girl I met at punk rock concerts when I was 24. She was obviously into me, and she kept giving me those blank hypnotized robot stares, which usually means you’re making them horny. At the end of one concert in 1982, we were saying goodbye, and she was in an intense robot mode, but I didn’t get her number, though I wanted to. My friend was with me and he was smiling and said:

          Isn’t she a bit young? 15?

          He was concerned.

          That’s how most people would be. They would not call you sick or pedophile, and it was understood that it was a normal reaction to want to fuck the girl, but those girls were called “jailbait,” and the general attitude was that they were dangerous as Hell because you might go to jail for having sex with them. The attitude was more like concern:

          Do you realize what you are doing here? This is a dangerous situation and you could get arrested.

          I never had sex with that girl, though part of me still wants to, and I absolutely fantasize about having sex with her as my 24 year old self and her being 15 to this very day. It’s a nice fantasy.

          I’m glad I didn’t do it. I have enough to live down and feel guilty about as it is. My worst was 21 and 14, seven years. 24 and 15, nine years, man, they would crucify me for that nowadays.

          My relatives from my Mom’s generation in their late 80’s continue to have this attitude. In fact, they refer to those girls as “jailbait.”

          Also, most women and girls were not feminists. Feminists were widely hated by girls and young women and were regarded as lesbians and man-hating bitches. Most girls and young women wanted to emphasize that they liked men because that was a cool attitude for a young female to have back in those days. Very few men were feminists and those who were tended to be regarded as wimps.

          But I was actually a member of the feminist organization NOW for a number of years in my late 20’s and early 30’s! They seemed moderate to me. My Mom was very proud of me but no one else cared.

          You never really heard about the radical bitches. Yes, we knew about McKinnon and Dworkin and the sexual harassment “unsafe environment” ruling, but those bitches were extremely unpopular, and most young people of both sexes despised them if they had even heard about them. They were regarded as radical, crazy bombthrowers.

          But mostly people were concerned about quid pro quo sexual harassment by men of their female underlings, which was epidemic at the time. Most of us didn’t like that very much.

          There was finally a case of I think firefighters where a woman firefighter sued under “unsafe environment.” The clubhouse was a macho place with pictures of hot women from girlie mags on the walls and a lot of crude talk and humor.

          People didn’t mind that much that she won. They would just say that men need to tone it down in the workplace if there were women around who didn’t like it.

          The number of men getting canceled, fired, and ruined for flirting with women, trying to get dates, or asking for phone numbers (this is almost all of sexual harassment these days) was about zero.

          If you went too far with a woman in the workplace, school, or elsewhere, which I definitely did sometimes, you would just get an attitude of:

          Hey, watch it buddy!

          along with a severe glance.

          You were expected to knock it off.

          People acted like adults instead of children and solved this problem among themselves without lawsuits, canceling, and getting people fired and ruined for the crime of trying to get laid. You know, back when adults acted like grownups instead of little children?

          There was no radicals versus liberals debate at the time, or if there was, I was not aware of it. Actually, 2nd wave feminists were pretty cool! In the 70’s, a lot of them campaigned to lower AOC laws. I forget the rationale but it was a pretty cool moment.

          The only thing I remember about Ed Meese was his “war on porn” bullshit, which was quite unpopular. He set up this commission to try to make porn illegal and it didn’t go over very well.

          Most women didn’t like porn very much, and most people didn’t watch it. The only way to get it for most people was to go to adult theaters. I used to go to the Mitchell Brothers theater all the time! You were just regarded as a pervert or maybe just a loser who could not get laid.

          I guess you could buy porn videos but I never knew anyone who did. I did rent a few porn videos in the 80’s. Also, we messed with the underground cable system so we could get free paid stations (we were stealing from the cable companies), and there was porn available on some of those channels, so some of us watched porn on our TV’s back then. Some people had porn videotapes.

          Some women hated porn. I know my Mom and aunts did. I remember one older woman aged 37 I dated when I was 21 who was against porn. But she hated feminists. To her, their whole shtick was:

          What about the woman? What about the woman?

          And she thought that was retarded.

          1. A lot of what you are talking about is the social environment (and probably even then only in the more ‘liberal’ areas of the country) of the early 1970’s to at best the early 1980’s. Sure, SOME of these attitudes carried over into the 90’s, but by then the legal, social, and educational framework had already been laid for the war on ‘child’ sex and porn to be expanded into the teenage years.

            The International NGO’s had already started to set up programs to influence the Age of Consent laws in other countries, below-18 porn had already been illegal for about a decade in the USA, and the feminists had JUST taken over academia (you know, where young minds are trained).

            All this stuff happened in the early to mid 90’s with the average person BLISSFULLY unaware. Oh, and don’t forget that the first “Sex Offender” lists were set up and made public during the mid to late 90’s. And let’s not forget that the first ‘child porn’ panics on the internet also started in the 90’s, which led to even more and tighter legislation.

            I also think when they gave in to the radicals on the sexual harassment front and not only declared a sexist standard (reasonable WOMAN instead of reasonable PERSON) for review but also basically made SH law about FEELINGS instead of objective acts. Quid pro quo is objective. That OFFENDS me is not. Well, that is where you give the game away. Heck, one famous case involved a guy whose only act was having a picture of his wife in a bikini on his desk.

            Nowadays Human Resources often function as feminist, ‘woke’ or both thought police (Did you tell your buddy a joke that offended ONE woman or protected minority?) and are even sometimes abused by females to get rid of innocent men because he and she were fighting for a promotion, and other times simply because he is unpopular.

            It is true that handsome and charismatic men often get far more leeway than a normal man, let alone some awkward geek, but no man is truly immune if he pisses off the wrong female coworker.

            And so I take exception to your attack on ‘crude male humor’. We forget that if we introduce women into a male environment, BOTH SIDES should have to make concessions, but instead its ALWAYS the men who have to give things up, grow a thicker skin, or put up with female behaviors, but never the other way around.

            This partly destroys male bonding. But it’s extremely dangerous in some environments: for instance, the modern US Military can’t decide whether women are just men with boobs or delicate flowers in need of special protections. One policy treats them one way (such as opening all combat arms positions to them but also lowering the standards) and most of the sexual harassment and sexual assault policies treat them the other way.

            That’s not how I see things. In a freaking combat environment, if someone can’t stand ‘crude’ humor, they shouldn’t be in a place with bombs, blood, and bullets. The military isn’t an ‘office’ job where everything should be pleasant. And people often NEED dark humor as a coping mechanism.

            On top of that soldiers are mostly young men, away from home AND any access to women often for months or years at a time. Do I give a SHIT if they are looking at porn or even, Hell, consensually fucking a prostitute? No, and neither should the military.

            And while if I were Company Commander, I would feel the need to protect my female soldier(s) from rape, at the same time, I’m not interested in dealing with or enforcing their FEELINGS. Who knows how much our military has been damaged by such ridiculous BS in the first place?

            Anyway, and back on the more normal home front where all this has played out for decades now, I’ve even seen some businessmen REFUSE to grow their businesses because then all the nutty and unfair SH laws and policies from the FEDS have to be implemented in the company once it reaches 100 or more employees.

            This stuff isn’t good for the economy. It’s not good for the military. And it’s not good for the country as a whole or the men in it.

          2. By “worst” you must surely mean “best”. To be warmly received by a young teen girl is the best God-given reward a man can experience. Congratulations on that!

            The USA is an evil homosexual fascist state (they even brag about this now – see John Kirby), doing all it can to export its rotting, diseased culture to the world before it implodes. Let’s hope it is fully contained by the BRICS alliance immediately. I do not have access to PayPal, but would love to give you some Monero, which is worth way more than a worthless dollar.

  2. Oh, one reform you forgot to mention:

    The total repeal of all ‘strict liability’ criminal or civil statutes when it comes to Age of Consent. If a girl or guy has a faux ID or looks older and downright fooled club security to get in the door, it’s RIDICULOUS and unjust to imprison a man or woman because of that.

    The reason for these laws (they exist in some but not all US States, as some States allow “mistake of age” as a defense) is to prevent an adult and teen from collaborating to protect the adult. But that’s BS. If the teen would do that, the teen obviously has worse issues than merely consenting to sex.

    Strict Liability as a general concept in law should be retired, and the few exceptions pushed back to the civil penalties it was intended to allow. Mens Rea is an important concept, and I’m surprised with how willing so many are to give it up, especially when it comes to sex or sexual choices they disagree with.

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