A Eugenic Effect for the Jizya Tax?

Makran writes:

The reason Christian Arabs from Lebanon/Syria/Jordan are smarter than Muslim Arabs or why Hindus from places like Bangladesh are smarter than Muslims is because of the Jaziya tax. Dhimmis or non-Muslims in Islamic lands had to pay a Jaziya tax or they would be killed, only escape from this is conversion to Islam. Thus the poorest low IQ sections of the population who could not pay the tax converted early.The smarter populations (and in the case of South Asia, the higher castes) used money to prevent conversion as much as possible. Thus the Muslims in these areas are predominantly low IQ genes while high IQ populations got separated into a different gene pool. Islam is dysgenic. Even Lew Kyan Yew of Singapore berated Malay Muslims for being dysgenic by the tendency of Muslims to marry even if the people involved were either very stupid of full of genetic diseases.

Do you think there is any truth to this? Interesting notion from the comments.

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36 thoughts on “A Eugenic Effect for the Jizya Tax?”

  1. Sounds like an excuse. It doesn’t change the fact a huge number of people in the Muslim world marry first cousins. But of course WNs look for excuses, cause they want to be friends with Muslims somewhat, seeing as the “enemy of my enemy is my friend”.

    1. A few WNists occassionally show support for Muslims but by and large they don’t like Muslims. This is my expereince from years of reading Stomfront and other WNist forums.

  2. I disgree with the OP and here’s why:
    A lot of Christians and Hindus in Pakistan are from the lower castes. From news stories, I noticed a noticeable phenotypic difference between Christian and Hindu Pakistanis and Muslims. In general the Christians and Hindus have indegenous phenotype.

    A lot of high caste Hindus converted to Islam because when Islamic armies invaded, these domiinant Hindu groups had to convert to preserve their dominant position. Especially so if the masses under them converted.

    It really isn’t a case of just the lower castes converting and the upper castes not. Both lower and upper castes converted and both stayed Hindu.

    I don’t know if the Christian Arabs are smarter than the Muslim Arabs; it may just be that the Christian Arabs do better in the West because they intergrate better and have a relatively free and non misogynistic society. Islam has a strong penchant to isolate its faithfull into mental ghettos.

    1. I don’t know if the Christian Arabs are smarter than the Muslim Arabs; it may just be that the Christian Arabs do better in the West because they intergrate better and have a relatively free and non misogynistic society. Islam has a strong penchant to isolate its faithfull into mental ghettos.

      Could it be isolation or being mentally challenged? 🙄 I’d say both with the mentally challenged aspect being the dominant problem.

    2. Christian always do better economically and educational in companrison to Arab Muslims.

      In the UK we see the same pattern with Non Muslim Indians doing better economically and educationally in comparison to Pakistani and Bangladeshi Muslims who follow the prophet, peace be upon him. Life is a test for a faithful Muslim so this information should be of little concern to the more pious Muslim.

      Indeed it is of little concern to me as I show respect to most people, including moderate Nazis like Schindler who in the goodness of his heart helped to rescue many jews from the hands of that monster, Hitler.

      As long as a moderate Nazi or a moderate KKK guy can shake hands with non whites such as a Jewish rabbi and his mullato boyfriend and get long then the basis of condemnation is no more. It is purely a cultural tendency which, for some historical reason, they as whites,enjoy.

      So it is white culture, but as long as the evil racist aspect is completely trashed then we can respect it as a tough, hard to understand white culture. For non whites it is hard to understand and then of course these whites love to curse non whites as Nazis. Again, it is the way whites think and their is a historical understanding that non whites need to understand,which is working within the matrix of this modus operandi. A benign understanding of white culture;and that is fine. All cultures, white and non white deserve respect. We all make mistakes and move on.

      So as non white we need to understand the Nazi and KKK aspects of white culture and the tendency of whites to demonise non whites in various ways, including that of calling them Nazis. It is all part of the white cultural package that whites have learnt from the twentieth century. In The nineteenth century it wash enslaving black people. So the tendency to be Nazis and KLansmen and women, slave traders and call people who are none whites,Nazis, is part of the historical DNA of whites.

      1. As if Hindus and Muslims do not “demonize” Goras/Europeans LOL

        You are too ignorant and uninformed of European culture to truly form any stereotype so your rote memory fixates on media images of “Period piece films” in addition to skewed notions of white female liberation based on watching a topless Norwegian in Goa while masturbating in the bushes.

        Hindus and Muslims during Independence 1947 hacked one another to pieces in their own neighborhoods. Just walked to the hut next door with a big Indian sickle and started slicing.

        Sikhs do better in the UK than Bengali Muslims or Pakistanis from Northern Kashmir but strangely their gangs are the worst in Canada (Possibly a small admixture of Russian blood leaves them more capable of organized violence which is why they fill the Indian military…they are Low IQ in the main).

      2. Pakistanis from West Kashmir and Bengali people from Dhaka might have the lowest IQ scores in Britain and arrived to do factory work AFTER the factories closed which just shows how unintelligent they are.

        Arab Muslims are quite bright as are Iranians.

        Bengali Hindus in Bangladesh are such a small minority that they barely make a consensus. Most of them have half as many children as a Bengali Muslim family which of course means more wealth and capitol but they also have a business association of sorts.

  3. From the Bible. Could it be a secret reference to retardation which would come from incest?

    20 And Noah began to be an husbandman, and he planted a vineyard:
    21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.
    22 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.
    23 And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father’s nakedness.
    24 And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him.
    25 And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.
    26 And he said, Blessed be the Lord God of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.
    27 God shall enlarge Japheth, and he shall dwell in the tents of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant. –Genesis 9:20-2

      1. You can see the effect on IQ here in the UK.Since coming to
        The U.K the Indian population got smarter because living in the west makes you smarter. However, this does not translate when you look at Muslims, who follow the prophet Mohammad, peace be upon him. One can see this in their educational and economic condition which, inshallah is not up to the same standard as indfidels. But surly Allah will guide the faithful to victory after a season of testing.

        Certainly you also appear to be racist when it comes to South Koreans. I have never seen so much vitriol against this fine group of people than from you. Indeed you may be the world leader in vitriol against South Koreans. So please do not call others racist when you are a world leader in hatred against South Koreans.

        1. A season of testing? That’s the excuse?

          I was just saying Koreans were shallow people. They’re not very nice to many people, and without just cause. They even have a high IQ, yet still mean.

        2. How about the link to the story of the Saudi girl? She lived her life crippled and in misery because her Muslim parents were an inbred couple. Was that fair to her? Was it a test? Surely she wil walk in paradise (sarcasm). 🙄

        3. At least Muslims, unlike Koreans, are kind to the crippled, even though Muslim inbreeding causes people to become crippled. 🙄

        4. BEHEADING “Pakis” are a a mix of really dim tribes up near Kashmir like Pathans or Punjabi and Dhaka Bengali are no geniuses either as a rule.

          Gulf Arabs and Iranians and Turks born in the West are Muslim but much more intelligent than their former subjects in Indonesia or Kashmir. Pakistanis are more intelligent than “West Pakistanis”…and so on.

          I’m a Gora but traveled all over India and it is clear that High-Caste Sikhs who trace their DNA to Eastern Europe are probably more intelligent than the average Pakistani or Bengali pimp/drug dealer with a sex-slave wife at home on Bradford dole….That does not say a great deal spectacular about Sikhs producing the next Albert Einstein or Bill Gates.

      2. I just want to add that the reasoning behind the curse was bullcrap, because Black Africans were seen as hailing from the line of Kush, not Canaan, for the hebrew term for a Black was “kushi”.

        However Kushites were actually just the Caucasian lineage that went into the Sudan Area and eventually mixed with Nilotics, thus giving birth to the Nubian-Black Image past 2,700 b.c.e

        Even then, this was only the Southern population that looked like that, the northerners just looked like darker caucasians like the Egyptians.

        Still, after comparing when the Religion started and when Nubians were Black looking it made sense that despite their “white” lineage the Jews still used the word “Black” to define them.

  4. “Islam is dysgenic”…I believe it. That’s the exact reason why I don’t have any Muslim friends and generally keep my distance from these people. Only time I would allow a Muslim in my circle is when he has denounced Islam. I’m sorry, It’s a poisonous death cult and people who are stuck in it, should step out. Unless you live in an Islamic country, there’s no punishment for apostasy.

    I’ve met my fair share of intelligent Muslims – neurosurgeons, engineers and other gifted high IQ people. Their company is definitely pleasant but deep down, they have been poisoned by the stupid belief system called Islam. It affects every aspect of their lives. For example,

    Even well-educated, intelligent Muslims see nothing wrong with consanguineous marriage that are widely prevalent in Islam. Marrying your first cousin, nephew or niece is only going to give you retarded kids. Now I agree all Muslims do not practice incest but enough of them do it on a regular basis thus, corrupting the entire Islamic gene pool. Nothing good can come out of it.
    Islam is an authoritarian religion and its founder, Muhammad was the most zealous, arrogant, fanatical characters in history. His followers also suffer from Authoritarian Personality Disorder which psychiatrists define as “a desire for security, order, power, and status, with a desire for structured lines of authority, a conventional set of values or outlook, a demand for unquestioning obedience, and a tendency to be hostile toward or use as scapegoats individuals of minority or nontraditional groups.”
    I recently met an educated Muslim gentleman, a networking engineer with more than 30 years experience. For work, I paid him a visit. The way he treats his employees was something I found deeply disrespectful. Ordering them around, boasting that he gave them all Macbooks to work on (no-one wants to hear that now, do they?) and claiming that he does not pay them peanuts.
    They take their religion so seriously. When your mind is so deep-set with rigid beliefs, there is no room for flexibility or debate. No food during Ramadan – what a stupid idea?

    I could go with countless examples. Just don’t like these people unless they are WILLING to be rid of these outdated belief systems.

    1. How about being sensitive to the needs of disabled people.

      If Islam has a dysgenic effect it deserves respect because it’s followers are disabled. Muslims are a disadvantaged, genitally mutilated people who are suffering from microencephalisation and mild retatrdation from a biological perspective. This should make you compassionate and thoughtful with regards to how you speak about such a disadvantaged disabled group of people.

      I will not accuse you of islampohobia, because anyone Who does not convert to Islam, the release of peace,is guilty of that, but I will accuse you of ablist attitudes.Have a care for the disabled!

      Personally I will speak respectfully of Islam because of the disablement I find within its ranks as it kindles the compassion in my heart.

    2. SHI Nair people built Kerala off remissions from Dubai etc. so a Hindu cannot be to harsh to the hand that feeds them.

      Muslim people generally prefer to “farm out” tasks to infidels.

      I’m not sure your average Parsee or Brahmin is much better in their behavior towards low-caste Indians or Goras either.

  5. What you define as ”dysgenics”, most if not almost all of religious leaders define ”eugenics” because the ”better man” will be exactly those who were the best follower/believer, as well happen in communism.

    1. I don’t believe in murdering the handicapped, as the Nazis did (or even coming strongly against services for the disabled). Nonetheless, I disapprove of “purposely creating them” thru high risk behavior, like incest promotion 🙄

    2. This is where inbreeding from Jay makes sense, eventually inbreeding makes a population more alike, even in thinking patterns, and once you add polygamy in the mix (though I’m no eugenist so I may be getting things twisted) that’ll pretty much give you a bunch of violent dogs at you’re disposal.

      I don’t mean to come off as so harsh, I’m just putting the math together.

  6. I would not agree. Although zakat was 2.5% (but this sum must be from no less than 20 dinars, so zakat is at least half a dinar) and jizya around 10% (but usually a couple of dinars), and that seemed an argument for conversion, but jizya was not an unbearable sum. Also Dhimmis were divided in three groups according to their wealth (the poorest paid one dinar and the wealthiest paid four). Even poor Dhimmis could afford to pay jizya and did not convert. Muslims rulers as well were not much interested in mass conversion. 1000 dhimmis could pay no less than 1000 dinars, while 1000 Muslims might pay just 500 dinars, and that sum theoretically went not to the local wazir but to other poor Muslims. And everybody paid a land tax as well, be they Muslims or Dhimmis.

    The problem with Dhimmis was not money, but their legal status of second class citizens. In many ways Islamic law discriminated them. So Dhimmis were rather hard-core religious fanatics who would not convert even under a threat of death. Dhimmis were not just wealthy non-believers but rather outcasts.

    While I understand all bad sides of Islam well, I do not see much difference between the Christianity and Islam from the point of view of common Medieval people (poor uneducated peasants and craftsmen). Common people did not care whether they would go to paradise with the help of Jesus or Muhammad. Islam is not that bad for those who believe (though is not so good for those who do not believe). I do not see much reason why Christians in the Medieval times would stick to their faith. What did it offer special to them in comparison with Islam? Religion is just a matter of faith in one guy or another. One guy says that there is the Trinity and Jesus, believe and you’d be in paradise. Another guy says that there is only one Allah and his messenger – Muhammad, believe and… yes, you’d also be in paradise. The result is the same.

    The other problem Dhimmis faced they have been always under a whim of the current ruler, which could or could not tolerate them. Some rulers like the Almoravids and Almohads openly repressed Dhimmis, while the others like the Ottomans tolerated them. This is why you did not find much Christians in Morocco or Arabia, but there are a lot of various minorities including quasi-Islamic sects in the Levant.

    Finally, Muslims were not always that stupid and poor. There were really thousands of scholars in the Islamic world. There were millions of wealthy Muslim merchants. They all were Muslim. Islam does not make you stupid and poor and Christianity does not make you smart and rich. Rather religious fanaticism makes everybody stupid, be they Muslims, Christians or Buddhists (Tibet was once rather a doomed degraded place). Though I admit that Islam has some bad inborn flaws that made it what it is now.

    1. Because the Moslem Cult keeps being held up as so “tolerant” and how “prosperous” Europe was under terrorist rule. They forget that not only did outsiders have to pay a heavy tax just to EXIST, but to submit every so often for humiliation.

      Now, it’s considered “horribly onerous” of us if we don’t accept their cult’s bad practices, from FGM to raping their hosts, but they don’t have to accept ANY of ours.
      How many Mosques are terrorists building in the Civilized World vs. how many churches in terrorist countries?
      How much violence committed in the NAME OF CHRISTIANITY — not just “by Christians”, I mean in the name of the Christian God — vs. in the name of the terrorist “God” Allah, in the last 20-some years?

      Even if you want to consider all religions equally fake, that’s fine, but please don’t pretend they’re all MORALLY equivalent!

      1. I once was very surprised when I got to know about a Russian (!) Orthodox church in Morocco. Mosques are being build in Christian countries because there are many Muslim immigrants there, but not many churches are being build in Muslim countries because there are not many Christian immigrants there. Simple. Do you offer to forbid construction of any religious non-Christian buildings in Christian countries? Where is democracy then? How then are you better than Islamists?

        But we were not speaking about Islamists or terrorists, but about the choice the medieval people had. Islam was not much worse than Christianity. One just had to pray 5 times a day, pay zakat (not a tax, but a charity), fast one month a year and do some other not difficult things (like not eating pork). How was it worse than Christianity?
        The reason that makes you think Christianity is better is that practically a few follows it today in the forms that were wide-spread in the Middle Ages. Most Christian nations today are very secular. Medieval Christianity had a lot of barbarities that are unthinkable today. But where Christianity is still strong, the barbarities there are not too far from the Middle Ages, see most of Latin America.

        And it is somewhat a hypocrisy to speak about wars in the name of Islam, when just for 15 years the USA have killed directly or indirectly a couple of millions of people during its wars in the name of its god called “democracy”. The USA should probably stop itself making and financing terrorists to prevent the global terrorism in the first place.

        I will not ask you not to pretend anything, and will not speak about moral, but you might read “Under Crescent and Cross” by Mark R. Cohen, it is an interesting comparison of two religions from the point of view of the medieval Jews.

        1. It’s not about keeping the moral high ground, it’s about keeping our culture! And why would there be any immigration if the guests are not allowed to keep their culture? That’s why whites stay out of terrorist countries, and if we banned Mosques, maybe terrorists would stay out of our countries?

          Back to the real world, all those immigrants flooding into Europe and the U.K. right now — look what they are doing to the place. How they are treating their host countries. They demand better food (they were given the same food everyone else eats) and better Internet Service.
          This is ungrateful, as Internet service is NOT part of the basics that REAL REFUGEES would be after! I also find the movement of “refugees” into Germany, UK, and Sweden — the countries with the biggest handouts — to be suspect, if not against international law, which stipulates “refugees” are to stop at the FIRST hospitable country they come to (Which would be Greece or Italy), not go shopping for the most generous at their own citizens’ expense!

          They beat up the men and rape, not just the women, but girls as young as 7. That’s just plain RUDE! And arguably disgusting.

          I have read that book, but I really don’t see the Jews as neutral observers here, given that a PBS documentary “Rise and Fall of Islamic Spain” squarely accused Jews of betraying their hosts into the terrorists’ less-than-tender mercies. If you believe that, without Jewish betrayal, 700 years of suffering would’ve been prevented, the Renaissance would’ve come sooner, and the Inquisition would not have been considered necessary. The Inquisition, you remember, was to root out and wipe out any future traitors. Sort of like our aborted McCarthyism — and just as the Verona Papers proved HE didn’t go far enough, terrorism in Spain present-day proved the Inquisition didn’t go far enough.

          Far better study material would be Samuel Huntington’s “Clash of Civilizations” — or anything by Samuel Huntington, really.

  7. This fear of Muslims is overdone and is part of the rightwing media campaign.

    The Muslims are suffering like crazy. The Middle East is in meltdow through war and financial ruin. Their people are due to lose a trillion dollars in the next five years and the biological component of their demographic is genitally mutilated and they are suffering from microencephalisation and mild mental retardation, so how about having a care these people. Their countries are in flames and the chance that they take over the he world for Allah is laughable.

    Just forget the right wing media and see the reality of the people we are dealing with. They are disabled and they deserve respect. Their biology is against them as I have explained. Economics is against them. Their economies are getting creamed because of the low oil price to the tune of a trillion dollars over five years; and if they think they are going to take over the world for Allah they deserve respected as a disabled delusional people.

    Respect costs nothing and is tune with the reality of this so called threat. Inshallah the Muslims will win. Just nod and move on. Nothing to see here.

    1. If you believe they are mentally disabled, we need not to respect nor fear them, but to RESTRAIN them, like the medical establishments would — and often DO — to any other violent crazy or retarded person!

      But I don’t think retardation should be an excuse to escape justice when they kill someone, or worse, rape someone, thereby spreading their substandard genes, right?

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