Who Should Christians Support in the Middle East?

Thelyniezian writes:

This kind of bothers me. More war and nations supplying arms to other nations. Proxy wars. Don’t get me wrong, I certainly do not like it when the West does it either.Given my particular Christian beliefs I am inclined to want to stand with Israel, but at the same time many of the things they seem to be doing (forcing Palestinians out of their homes in order to build settlements, disproportionate responses to attacks from Hamas etc.) do not help matters in practice. I dare say this is one area where I might not be in agreement with Robert.

Whatever is right or wrong, I can’t exactly seeing this end well.

Israel treats Christians like shit. Traditionally, Jews have always hated Christians, and most Jews I have met feel pretty much the same way.

If you are pro-Christian, you should be for Hezbollah and Syria. Hezbollah gets along immaculately with the Christians who live in South Lebanon, and there is even a huge Christian political faction that is allied with Hezbollah right now.

All of the Syrian Christians love Assad, and most of them really hate Israel. I spoke to a Syrian Christian once and he was one of the wildest anti-Semites I have ever met.

I dated an Iranian Christian recently, and you would not believe what an Israel-hater she was. She could have been a Muslim based on the way she talked. She was also rather anti-Semitic.

You will find that a lot of Middle Eastern Christians are real Israel-haters, and a lot of them are pretty anti-Semitic to boot. Israel hasn’t done a good job of winning friends and influencing people over there to say the least.

Has anyone here ever met a Palestinian Christian? I have, and they hate Israel so much you would be shocked. When they talk you would almost think it is Hamas talking. Most of them support a group called the PFLP which is about as radical as Hamas although it is secular. Many of the PFLP’s supporters are Palestinian Christians.

US policy has been a catastrophe for the Christians of Mesopotamia and the Levant. Secular dictators who were very friendly to and protective of the Christians were removed, and what boils down to Al Qaeda and ISIS took their place. So many Iraqi Christians have died. Almost every Iraqi Christian knows someone who has been killed in the war. The community has collapsed and 50% have left the country. The US is essentially complicit in the virtual genocide of the Mesopotamian Christians.

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24 thoughts on “Who Should Christians Support in the Middle East?”

    1. Evangelicalism that is found in Murka has nothing to do with tradtional Christianity.

      Real Christianity has been dead since the Vatican II in the 1960s, a coup made by jews against the Church.

      1. @indravaruna:

        The assumption is made here that much of what is called “traditional Christianity” is anything to do with real Christianity as taught by Jesus and the apostles either, even when it contradicts the plain teaching of Scripture.

        (Some might add that the NT writings are not what Jesus originally taught either, but I do not believe those people are correct.)

        If pre-Vatican II Catholicism was correct, why would anyone have seen the need for the Reformation? (We might even go so far as the Great Schism, seeing as the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox types like to claim that they are the same as the church Jesus founded and consistent with the original teachings, yet the Catholics have got it wrong somewhere.)

        Obviously all are a bunch of schismatics and heretics, no doubt.

        1. the vatican II didn’t want to reform the Church as much as DESTROY it. Eastern and Western churches separated because of politics.

  1. I find Jordan to be the least distasteful middle eastern country. They are comparatively progressive and end up with a lot of the refugees from the various conflicts. I don’t love the Iranian clerical leadership, but view Iran as at worst a monster of of the U.S. and U.K.’s creation and find myself quite sympathetic to the Iranian people and secular government.
    I view Israel and Saudi Arabia as the worst actors in the region.

  2. Hey Robert!

    There is a guy named Eliasalucard who runs a popular anthro forum called forum.biodiversity, have you ever talked or conversed with him before? This guy is one of the most excellent commentators and analysts of basically Middle Eastern people and the region in general online.

    He tells and analyzes from a personal and non-p.c generalized viewpoint that is of extreme authenticity and legitimacy. He is honestly the only guy I would ever trust when it comes to anything to do with Middle Eastern people in general and how they operate culturally, because when I read what he writes about them then it makes sense why everything there is the way that it is. He tells the truth and tells it like it is, which I found severely lacking unfortunately on news articles and blog posts by people who are not from there.

  3. Christian condition in Israel is not too bad, and actually is quite good, despite being 2nd class citizens.

    The real enemies of Christian is not Jews but Sunni Islamo countries like Egypt, Paki, Saudi, Malaysia…etc

    1. Creaders, you are not from there and you are an Asiatic, you know absolutely nothing about the MENA regions from the inside so I suggest you stay off this topic.

      The Jews are manufacturing the genocide of Christians in the Middle East via the Muslims. One of the heads of ISIS was actually a Jewish Israeli actor whose identity was leaked by Snowden. ISIS is not attacking Israel for a reason. But I suggest you stay out of these debates and arguments…

      1. You are speaking utter nonsense. I am a Jew and my family was in Baghdad for hundreds of years, before Arab nationalist kicked them out. First goes Jews, then Christians, yet somehow Jews and Israel get blamed, yet Arab nationalism, Pan-Arabism, and Arab Muslims, as the hegemonic imperial majority in West Asia, miraculously manage to escape any critique!

  4. Acknowledging Israel’s right to exist, even that it might be somehow part of God’s plan in fulfilment of prophecy, does not automatically mean one condones all the actions of Israel or unsaved Jews in general.

    It is quite clear from Scripture that not all of Israel was perfect in their entire history; that many sinned, that there were those who killed the prophets of old and their descendents likewise were instrumental in having Jesus put to death and perscuting the early church. It’s clear from Paul’s writings that one day “all Israel will be saved”, but at The End.

    As it is, one can hardly expect them all to be not hostile to Christians, and I certainly understand at least that those Jews who have converted to Christianity are not considered Jews for the purposes of having the right to “make aliyah”.

    Of course there are many, even evangelicals who think there is scripural support against the idea that the present naton state of Israel represents the fulfilment of prophecy, given their right to remain in the Holy Land was always conditional on the part of God. Most of my church are pro-Israel, most of my leftie activist friends who espouse Chrisitanity tend to be pro-Palestine. As it is I can see the merits to both sides.

    Of course Christian Zionism makes very little sense from a worldly perspective. Why would you want to help people who may be hostile to your faith? Why would you want to do so when there are claims those same people are undermining the rights of the existing inhabitants and causing them suffering?

    Then again, it’s not like everything taught in Scripture or what it depicts concerning the will of God makes a lot of sense either. (There are cases in the prophetic writins where God supposedly uses such-and-such a nation to judge Israel for their sins one moment and criticises them for their pride the next.) And it’s not like we can be all too sure about the whole Israel/Palestine issue when there are claims and counter-claims from both sides. (Same as any geopolitical issue where conflict exists. Ukraine for example, Syria/ISIS another.)

    What I certainly don’t think is that supporting armed militant groups who might seem to support the interests of Christians, quite squares with the teachings of “love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you”, “put your sword away, for he who lives by the sword shall die by the sword”, “for our war is not against flesh and blood”, etc.

    (I do agree that legitimate nation states have the right to have armed forces to defend themselves and that conflict is sometimes a necessary evil; those groups who are not explicitly state actors even though they may have an otherwise legitimate political presence, I am not sure about. This is not to suggest Christians should advocate the use of force, though.)

    Nor is bending over backwards to condone or overlook everything the nation state of Israel does.

    As said, not all nominally Chrisitan persons even within the ME are any more than culturally so nor do most represent what most evangelicals consider sound, but I think in any case we have a duty to love others and take a humanitarian interest in helping them regardless. I don’t suggest that all are unsaved, even those nominally Orthodox, Eastern Catholic etc. I do know of those over there who do strive for peace not just conflict (there’s a guy whose autobiography I’ve read, Palestianian Christian, he’s now an archbishop, can’t recall his name).

    (Sorry Robert if the paragraphs are too long, and I know we are in disagreement over this issue somewhat.)

  5. My views concerning Assad? No idea what to think, but to suggest under his rule there was a fair amount of stability and protection from Chrisitans against the nastier Islamist factions. If it is really in doubt that there are any truly “moderate” rebels left (or if there ever were) to form a political solution, then Assad seems the lesser of two evils if what we want is to get rid of ISIS.

    However it seems that getting rid of ISIS is just an excuse for some actors; Turkey certainly and possibly even Russia.

    1. (Whether you can include any Western powers here I don’t know. Certainly part of the modus operandi is get rid of Assad, and that has led to the arming of rebel groups that ended up fuelling ISIS. Beyond that…?)

  6. The American Evangelical right is brainless, they think what their leaders tell them to think and their leaders just parrot the the Bush/Cheney/Rummy/NeoCon worldview.

  7. Easy. Support Assad. Every other faction in that conflict either kills christians, allies with people who do, or is complicit while other factions do. The same could be said for druze, ismaelis, etc.

    There is actually a very interesting subreddit on reddit called syriancivilwar which is probably one of the best sources for info on that conflict. There was a poll a few months ago concerning the regular posters. The majority were atheists and most supported Assad.

    Also, I do know a Palestinian Christian. The first time I met her, she said that she didn’t even want to say that country’s name.

    1. Yes I went to the Syriancivilwar subreddit and it was swarming with supporters of the terrorists, I mean the rebels. Truly disgusting. Most of the people who supported the terrorists were either Syrians or Americans.

      1. Yeah, they are there too. There is one called theLord444 or something like that that actually supports ISIS. However, many seem to support assad, even if it’s just because he is the lesser of two evils.

        Also, even many assad supporters there can see that the SAA is almost entirely incompetent.

      1. Multiple jobs, going to grad school, and buying a house will do that too you. It;s hard to believe that it’s been 4-5 years since I posted here regularly. I have posted here and there at times. I may be doing it a little more in the future, but I can’t do it at the level I once did anymore. The time has gone like a whirlwind. Do Cyrus, BAG, or Dota still post here at all?

        1. Wade! Good to see you again, old chap. I definitely missed your trenchant and edifying comments. By all means, feel free to frequent Occident Invicta. Of course, I am also more than happy to chat with you here, just like old times!

  8. “Has anyone here ever met a Palestinian Christian? I have, and they hate Israel so much you would be shocked.”

    Have you heard a documentary that was released recently called “The Wanted 18.” It is about a largely christian Palestinian town and there attempts to found a dairy farm during the first Intifada. I saw it recently. It was very interesting.

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