Thoughts on Secessionism of Afrikaners and Chechens

AJ writes:

The Afrikaners are a nation, so do you support stuff like Orania, and Eugene TerreBlanche’s Afrikaner Front trying to carve an independent Boer state in South Africa?

That is an interesting question. Sure Afrikaners can be independent, I think. But they have to let non-Afrikaners live there too, since a lot of them were there first.
I don’t support self-determination so you can form your shitty little fascist dog states and throw out all the “impure, non-national people.”
The Kosovars did that. I support their independence, but they have behaved like total jerks ever since.
The Kosovars acted despicably. They were like, “We have a right to self-determination!” Then when they got it, they ethnically cleansed everyone not a Kosovar Albanian! And then they decided hypocritically that while minorities in Serbia had a right to split, no minorities in Kosovo would have a right to split! Forget that.
This is the problem with separatism. The separatists wage a just war against a fascist state, and then as soon as they get freedom, they start their own evil fascist nation-building project and suddenly that wonderful right of secession is immediately revoked.
The Afrikaner Front are serious racists, militant Nazi White Supremacists. I’m not sure scumbags like that have a right to self-determination to create some little Nazi White Supremacist state. Anyway, most Afrikaners would not want to be part of such a state. They might want independence, but not under the AF.
The ANC are typical backwards Africans. Africans are typical barbarians, too uncivilized to allow any separatism without committing mass murder in the process. Look at Eritrea, Biafra, Somalia, Ethiopia and Sudan. Even Arabs are as barbaric as Africans in this regard. Look at the genocidal response of Morocco to the Polisario Front.
AJ:

Chechnya is already semi-autonomous, they have their own culture and laws and everything, what else do they want?

Independence? Chechens have been fighting for their freedom since the days of Shamil. It took Russian imperialism 60 years to conquer the place, and it’s been in periodic rebellion ever since. Obviously, they never assented to annexation in the first place, eh?
I consider those Caucasian Muslims to be serious pests and troublemakers who are doing nothing but blowing things up and killing people in Russia. Be gone with them. Allow a referendum on independence within the context of the CIS. You can even negotiate further. Russia can station military bases there with the option of reconquering the place if Chechens start acting up again. Make independence dependent on a number of Russia-friendly prerequisitives. Win-win.

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67 thoughts on “Thoughts on Secessionism of Afrikaners and Chechens”

  1. Ok, there is a difference between democratic self rule and mass democracy which is nothing but mob rule. The Afrikaner Front no longer exists, Afrikaners in Orania do rule themselves but unfortunately have to pay taxes to the fascist state, I agree all states are fascists. Hitler, Stalin and your average neo-liberal differ very little in there idea of the central state, Orania on the other hand is healthy localism.
    America has been on a centralizing path ever since denying the South self-rule and with that came the imperialism and militant democracy we see today. I think it is because like Communism, Social-democracy must spread violently or die. In Kosovo it was American militant intervention that gave Kosovo independence and also helped deny it to the Serbs in the north, again just like Paris 1919 powerful governments gives it to one and denies it to another.
    In today’s world there is no function of government that the small private companies can not do more efficient and cost effective, so why have government at all? I suggest you go to http://mises.org/media.aspx to learn more about the moral right to secession and on how private towns and justice systems can work.
    Back to Orania, they will not let non-Afrikaners stay there, and why should they? It is not a state. They will rule over themselves and will refuse to rule over others, they will purchase land legally and not chase people away like Israel did, they can not afford a new moral crisis, and they know it – so by what standard do you call them Fascist, if they oppose the central state? They might not want Zulu’s or Venda’ amongst them,(racist you might scream) but they are also not going to allow millions of Germans, Jews or Eskimo’s in, it is there project to give them a home of there own.
    When German Chancellor Merkel declared “Multiculturalism failed, utterly failed” many “right-wingers” got all worked up and happy, not me, I fear what’s next, First we had forced segregation then forced integration, forced multiculturalism, forced bussing, forced sensitivity. Good God man, while America is dropping bombs allover the world to make it save for democracy, they will imprison little Johnny if he even tried to have a “whites only chess club” because that would be a danger to peace and human rights everywhere!!!
    Final comment, There is black communities in America, gay communities, Muslim communities in Europe, China Towns everywhere, and in all of Sub-Sahara Africa there is one white town, not a 1000 not a100 just 1 and the left is outraged, “how dare you exist!”

  2. “Independence? Chechens have been fighting for their freedom since the days of Shamil. It took Russian imperialism 60 years to conquer the place, and it’s been in periodic rebellion ever since. Obviously, they never assented to annexation in the first place, eh?”
    That’s because they were fighting for the Ottoman Empire wanting to be incorporated into it that’s why Georgia and other regions like Abkhazia and Ossetia volunteered to join the Russian Empire who unlike Chechnya were separate countries and about for a 100 years were involved in raids against the Russian and Ukrainian South selling Christian women into the harem Ottoman sex slave industry, converting the children to Islam and killing or enslaving men.
    And there rebellion was unsuccessful because Caucus forces majority were aligned with Russia who Shamil’s forces would do attacks on villages. He was later forced to negotiate with Russia living in St Petersburg until his death. It has been a while since a read the historical biography so I could be wrong.
    They have always fought to a foreign power wither it be Turkey, Britain, Nazi Germany and now the NWO both in the Caucasus and abroad.
    I consider those Caucasian Muslims to be serious pests and troublemakers who are doing nothing but blowing up shit and killing people in Russia. Be gone with them. Allow a referendum on independence within the context of the CIS. You can even negotiate further. Russia can station military bases there with the option of reconquering the place if Chechens start up shit again. Make independence dependent on a number of Russia-friendly prerequisitives. Win-win.”
    You seem to think Chechen are independent and not a puppet proxy force of NATO, US, Britain, etc.
    They were given that opportunity after the first war and they immediately started expanding the terror network internationally and working with foreign powers fighting alongside the Taliban and help establish diplomatic relations even having an Embassy setting up 3 terrorist training camps, training in military camps in Turkey and Waziristan and training by military instructors in Britain and the US.
    Worse is they are developing chemical, radiological and biological weapons.
    During their quasi independent period they committed every crime under the sun running death squads in Russia cities and organised crime rings, drug and sex trafficking kidnap and murder of children for ransom, rape, ethnic cleaning, torture, slavery, circulating fake dollars into the Russian economy, snuff films, setting up terrorist camps and schools not just in Chechnya but in neighbouring Dagestan, etc.
    Even today the Republic is subsidised to the tune of billions with new apartments and facilities who pretty much run the Republic as they please.
    Russian has military bases in Kosovo and that didn’t stop pogroms and ethnic cleansing against the Serbs.
    Anyway it is not really about Chechnya it is about using them to gain a foothold in the North Caucasus and control of Caspian oil at the very least stop Russian transit routes through Grozny and annex the region to gain control of Dagestan with is the real target which has the largest landmass next to the Caspian basin for transiting oil to the EU.
    The current BTC pipeline and the proposed Nabucco pipeline can only carry a minimal amount of what Russia can export unless they export via Iran which is not going to happen anytime soon.
    It’s geo-politics.

  3. yeah, what Jack (johnUK) said. On Kosovo, it has always been part of Serbia, Serbians are the native people of Kosovo and used to be the majority, they were ethnically cleansed. Oh, and Afrikaners were in South Africa before most of those blacks were there, the biggest indiginous people are the Khoisans. http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoisan?wasRedirected=true Then other blacks followed the Whites around, as the Boer built a civilization. Its funny that you are sympathetic to Chechens yet call Afrikaner seperatists neo-nazis and all that stuff. The Chechen rebels are much bigger assholes than the Boers will ever be. the Afrikaner Front never slaughtered hundreds of schoolchildren and ethnically cleansed hundreds of thousands of the “other” ethnic group. Plus, in South Africa, the ANC are communists, why dont you like them? The ANC is actually much more racist than the previous Apartheid government. The killing of the white Boers has reached genocidal proportions and being a farmer in SA is one of the most dangerous jobs in the world, over 4,000 have been killed. Apartheid killed much less than the ANC. Theres been a White exodus from SA in the millions because black supremacy and typical African violence has exploded. South Africa is going to go the way of Zimbabwe and cut off its nose to spite its face. They hate whites so much down there that Zim. would rather be a starving shithole-country than let the Boers farm. After Mugabe took the Boer farms and gave them to incompetent blacks, the Zimbabwean economy imploded, and now blacks eat rats. Hooray black liberation, yeah! Im very concerned with the high birth rate in sub-saharan Africa, their population is exploding, in a few decades blacks will be over a third of the world population and will try to take it over demographically. Civilization will rot, because most black people are uncivilized.

    1. 90% before WW1.
      Here is the hypocritical Zionist the late Tom Lantos in Kosovo in 1990 promising them support and independence.
      “As Tom Lantos (D-Ca.), sponsor of the latest House resolution
      supporting the independence of “Kosova,” noted in House hearings, addressing Nicholas Burns of the State Department: “Let me just raise a few items, Mr. Secretary. The first one: just a reminder to the predominantly Muslim-led governments in this world that here is yet another example that the United States leads the way for the creation of a predominantly Muslim country in the very heart of Europe. This should be noted by both responsible leaders of Islamic governments, such as Indonesia, and also for jihadists of all color and hue. The United States’ principles are universal, and in this instance, the United States stands foursquare for the creation of an overwhelmingly Muslim country in the very heart of Europe.

      [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjbu6pyc230&fs=1&hl=en_GB]

  4. “America has been on a centralizing path ever since denying the South self-rule and with that came the imperialism and militant democracy we see today.”
    Not true! American has been on a centralizing path ever since the ratification of the constitution in 1791. What happend in the 1860’s was the logical out come of federalism. Good luck finding any information about that in an american school text book.

    1. The 1860s reforms were also the logical outcomes of the fact that the telegraph had made communications instantaneous and steam engines had made deploying troops anywhere in the country a matter of days.
      In 1791 word still traveled at the speed of a horse an an army the speed of a march interrupted by nightly encampments.

  5. No, America was on a centralizing path ever since the Declaration of Independence replaced the Articles of Confederation! It was doomed to a death spiral of centralization from the very start! Oh noes!

  6. Independence? Chechens have been fighting for their freedom since the days of Shamil. It took Russian imperialism 60 years to conquer the place, and it’s been in periodic rebellion ever since. Obviously, they never assented to annexation in the first place, eh?
    Which is why I always had a soft spot for them.
    If you are a nation of less than a million, and you take on a nuclear armed former super-power of 130 million, and you manage to actually win the first round, and almost the second…Maybe it’s the former soldier in me, but you are ‘A’ okay in my book.

  7. Dear Robert
    The right to secession is subordinated to the principle of majority rule. Only national or religious minorities that are a clear majority in the area for which they claim the right of secession actually have the right to secede. The white Afrikaners are not a majority in any part of SA beyond the local level. They are not like the French-Canadians, 90% of whom live in Quebec, where they are about 80% of the population. The Franco-Quebeckers have the right to secede, but the Afrikaners do not.
    The golden rule for a minority is: concentrate yourself in one area and then make that area as homogeneous as possible. If French Canadians had been 100% of the population of Quebec, they already would have seceded because in the last referendum, 60% of the Franco-Quebeckers voted for secession. They still narrowly lost because nearly 100% of Anglo-Quebeckers voted against secession.
    It is also lack of geographic concentration which make any talk of black separatism in the US silly. Nowhere do blacks constitute even 60% of the population, except at the municipal level.
    Regards. James

  8. All counties, cities, provinces and towns should succeed from the central state regardless of there ethnic composition. Under a gold standard this would of course be possible.
    I agree that people should form a majority in order to claim there independence, but Orania is exactly that, it is a movement for internal immigration and ethnic consolidation like Zionism was. Under apartheid there was ample cheap black labor available, but then again this is Africa, cheap black labor is still plentiful. If a people want to form an ethnic majority they need to do there own labor, no guess-workers and all that, and that, is exactly wat they do in Orania – There own labor.
    The problem is not small nations wanting independence but big powers and there double standards we see it with Russia insisting South-Ossetia gets independence and denying it to Chechnya and America Insisting the Kosovar-Albanians gets it but not the Serbs in the north. The one is not more holy then the other Serbs and Albanians have been slaughtering one another for what seems like millennia.
    I am an open border kind of a guy with a twist! No government should have the right to control the movement of people, but people should retain the right to discriminate on any and all grounds necessary as they see fit, and government should never have this right. Currently we have from government the opposite of course discrimination in the name of anti-discrimination.
    http://www.orania.co.za

    1. How childish, I bet you deep in Chechnya around a campfire, they “get off” speaking of that glorious day when those pesky Afghans fly into American buildings fweeee Boem, Fweeee Boem. Be careful who you choose as enemies Mr America, and twice as careful who you choose as friends.

  9. ” Personally, I just “get off ” on watching Chechens kill Russians. Those wacky Chechens … They are just so GOOD at it !” Go to Russia and tell them that.

    1. I’ve been to Russia, actually. Wasn’t too impressed.
      Russians are a lot like Americans from the mid-west and south. A lot of talk. Little action. 😀

  10. Yes, defeating Napoleon, the Mongols, Hitler and the Nazis, the Chechens, aiding the Vietnamese to defeat the “mighty” Americans, the US and Israel trained and armed Georgians in the South Ossetia War, and financing the Civil Rights Movement and Martin Luther King in the US, and aiding the anti-apartheid socialists in Africa was “all talk and no action”. As opposed to you, who must be a harcore badass, and whatever fucked country you come from. Dont like Russians? Then stay the fuck out of Russia, you dumbass, why the hell were you there? LOL!

      1. @Robert Lindsay
        So he is pissed of at Russia because they are helping develop Iran’s nuclear program?
        Despite the propaganda it was actually the US and Britain once the Iranian revolution was in full swing nurtured it denying the Shah access to the BBC once mass protests were afoot to address the people so they could use Islamic militants to weaken Arab nationalists groups aligned with Moscow having a presence in the Mid East.
        Iran supported militants in Afghanistan 79, Bosnia 91 and in Chechnya 97-2004.
        Global Research did a go series of articles on the Islamic proxy army prior to September the 11th.
        Was the fact that the Iranian revolution happened and at the same time US started to secretly train Islamic militants 6 months prior to Soviets invasion of Afghanistan in 79 a coincidence? I don’t think so.

        1. So he is pissed of at Russia because they are helping develop Iran’s nuclear program?
          You call that “help?”
          Jesus Christ your naive, John. It is far more complex than that.
          It is more akin to a racket on there part. Of course, that pretty much sums up everything in the foreign business policies of post Soviet Russia.

        2. @Cyrus
          You call that “help?”
          Jesus Christ your naive, John. It is far more complex than that.
          It is more akin to a racket on there part. Of course, that pretty much sums up everything in the foreign business policies of post Soviet Russia.”

          How is it a racket?
          European countries and companies are also involved in building Iran’s nuclear facilities like Siemens and allegations of Iran acquiring illegal nuclear components for its nuclear program are from states like Pakistan and North Korea which according to FBI whistleblower Sibel Edmonds Israel and Turkey are involved in black market nuclear smuggling network.

        3. How is it a racket?
          The power plant is more than ten years behind schedule…Ever wonder why Iran has to “buy” Russian weapons/crap every few years that is does not need/want?
          European countries and companies are also involved in building Iran’s nuclear facilities like Siemens and allegations of Iran acquiring illegal nuclear components for its nuclear program are from states like Pakistan and North Korea which according to FBI whistleblower Sibel Edmonds Israel and Turkey are involved in black market nuclear smuggling network.
          Siemens was involved in Iran for many things, but not with it’s nuclear program since the 70’s. The design is basically a Westinghouse, with everything else done to Russian/Soviet standards. Hence, Russia is the prime contractor.
          As for Sibel Edmonds, she happened upon the obvious. Its all about money. True ideologues are nothing but dinosaurs.

    1. Yes, defeating Napoleon, the Mongols, Hitler and the Nazis, the Chechens, aiding the Vietnamese to defeat the “mighty” Americans,
      The Mongols made Russia howl, and what was the kill ration between the Germans and Russians in WWII?
      I would hardly put the mighty Chechens on that list, though. Too small. Like a bodybuilder taking joy at beating up on a toddler…The Chechens did win the first war, don’t forget. 🙂
      financing the Civil Rights Movement and Martin Luther King in the US,
      Doubly ironic, when you realize how Goddamn racist the average Russian is. The Soviets did it for their own selfish reasons. Nothing more.
      As opposed to you, who must be a harcore badass,
      Why, thank you. I do consider myself a little “grizzled” at times. 🙂
      and whatever fucked country you come from.
      California may have it’s problems right now, but I think you are being kinda harsh.
      Dont like Russians? Then stay the fuck out of Russia, you dumbass, why the hell were you there? LOL!
      Just an American Express carrying Yankee tourist, with the need slap a few “Natashas” around for shits and giggles.

      1. @Cyrus
        and whatever fucked country you come from.
        California may have it’s problems right now, but I think you are being kinda harsh.

        Did the Mexicans there finally declare independence and claim California as an independent state?
        About fucking time.
        [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R10ljA0-sHs&fs=1&hl=en_GB]

        1. Dream on.
          The U.S is more likely to break apart before that ever happens. Besides, I happen to like Mexicans a lot, and I wouldn’t mind California as a independent nation-state.
          Unlike Scotland, we actually contribute something to humanity. You couldn’t survive without the rest of the U.K. California would actually profit greatly without the rest of the U.S. The rest of America is a pariah on our health and wealth.

        1. We’re not the the ones threatening to wipe Israel off the planet.
          Funny thing is, I’m a big Israel supporter.
          The only bad aspect of Israeli society this last decade or two, is the racist Russian immigrants, and their influence.

      1. @Cyrus
        “The only bad aspect of Israeli society this last decade or two, is the racist Russian immigrants, and their influence.”
        Apart from the fact that the most hard line Zionists come from the US like Barouch Goldstein.

  11. @Cyrus True, Mongols took over Russia hundreds of years ago, but look at the 2 nations today. The ratio in WWII was 1.3 Russian deaths to 1.0 German deaths. So what? Russia still won, deal with it, what are you, a nazi? The Chechens didnt “win” the first war, did they get independence? No, they got a peace treaty. Them trying to take on Russia isnt brave, its just stupid. Without Russia, blacks would still be segregated in the US and wouldnt be voting. You can dismiss Soviet involvement all you want, but we still played a crucial role. Russians are racists? LOL. Who had slavery and segregation and lynchings? Who wiped out the Native Americans? Umm, Im pretty sure California isnt a nation. “Just an American Express carrying Yankee tourist, with the need slap a few “Natashas ” around for shits and giggles.” Like most Muslims, you are a coward and a bigot. Try to “slap around” a few Vladimirs and Fyodors for shits and giggles. You’re a big Israel supporter? Russian immigrants didnt “make” Israel racist, theyre Jews anyways, not really Russians. Im not surprised you support Israel, because it is a racist, fascist, apartheid, Zionist state. Good bye, have fun in the Republic of California, which is a new country apparently.

    1. The ratio in WWII was 1.3 Russian deaths to 1.0 German deaths.
      LOL!!! Typical brainwashed Russkie…You actually believe that crap?
      About 3.5 million Germans killed on the Eastern front, for about 11-12 million Soviet troops. This does not count the Soviet civilian causalities, which about doubles the number.
      The Chechens didnt “win” the first war, did they get independence?
      I call that winning. They weren’t out to take Moscow.
      Them trying to take on Russia isnt brave, its just stupid.
      I call that “spunk.”
      Without Russia, blacks would still be segregated in the US and wouldnt be voting.
      I actually thank American Jews for that, more than anything else. 🙂
      The rest of your post is silly, so I won’t waste my time answering.

  12. I don’t know for sure, but reading this I get the feeling that Cyrus is one of those LA Perisans I’ve heard about that are total neocons. (Hates Russia, Loves israel, constantly crying about “racism”, plus several other dumbass neocon traits…) Maybe he’s even a Persian jew.

    1. He’s not a Jew. He’s some kind of secular Iranian Azeri from a Christian and Muslim background, but I don’t think he’s religious. I think the only reason he likes Israel is because he dislikes Arabs, as most Iranians do.

      1. Robert is spot on. I am in fact an atheist. Most of “us” are, either here in the states, or increasingly in Iran in some form or another. Or at least utterly agnostic to the point of apathy.
        Calling me a “Muslim” just shows where a lot of these guys are coming from. 🙂

        1. “Calling me a “Muslim” just shows where a lot of these guys are coming from. ”
          I didn’t call you a muslim. I called you a neocon…which is even worse than a muslim.

        2. Wade, that was aimed at A.J and JohnU.K. Not you.
          I do kinda of like the way “NeoCon” sounds though. Has a nice ring to it.

  13. LOL@Persian neocon. Robert Lindsay, do you support La Reconquista? I know your conflicted on immigration, but are you OK with millions of Mexicans taking the Southwest and turning it into Aztlan?

  14. the proceedings that happens in today’s Russia is very similar to tragedies that had been performed to native people of America in earlier centuries. Russians don’t belong to this region. if a nation, Chechen, spends one million human to get independent, it is human right of that nation, I think. their language and culture are destroying and their huge petrol reserves is stolen by Russians. Russians should accept that they are alien in Caucasus and Transcaucasia.
    as an Azerbaijani Turk from Iran, I think that nations of region have been awakened and this wave of national awakening are spreading sequentially among nations of around regions.

    1. @yashar bugun
      “Russians don’t belong to this region. if a nation, Chechen, spends one million human to get independent, it is human right of that nation, I think. their language and culture are destroying and their huge petrol reserves is stolen by Russians. Russians should accept that they are alien in Caucasus and Transcaucasia”
      What BS their culture and language is being preserved and promoted with their own TV channels, video hosting sites, subsidised housing and free social benefits, etc to the tune of billions.
      Even during there defacto Independence period there was a Chechen embassy and cultural centre in Moscow.
      A million people what BS nobody claims that impossible amount even the lowest estimate by the mass media is BS repeating the same lies as they did in the Balkans.
      If Russians are aliens then why are the majority of the people supportive of Russia?
      Even in Chechnya separatists do not have much support.
      What about Nagorno-Karabakhdo the same standards apply there?

      1. What BS their culture and language is being preserved and promoted with their own TV channels, video hosting sites, subsidised housing and free social benefits, etc to the tune of billions.
        Even during there defacto Independence period there was a Chechen embassy and cultural centre in Moscow.

        As usual, bullshit.
        The Chechens have been almost wiped out several times over by the Russians since the 19th century.
        You sound like an American who thinks the Natives Americans should be thankful to the “White Man” for all they got. What a load of pretentious, racist crap.
        A million people what BS nobody claims that impossible amount even the lowest estimate by the mass media is BS repeating the same lies as they did in the Balkans.
        Several hundred thousand Chechens have died since the beginning of hostilities in ’94. They are now a broken people, so I wouldn’t give much credence to what they may think, for now.
        If Russians are aliens then why are the majority of the people supportive of Russia?
        Simple. They don’t. Just what is the alternative? Endless death and destruction?
        Get real.

    2. I think. their language and culture are destroying and their huge petrol reserves is stolen by Russians. Russians should accept that they are alien in Caucasus and Transcaucasia.
      as an Azerbaijani Turk from Iran, I think that nations of region have been awakened and this wave of national awakening are spreading sequentially among nations of around regions.

      Yashar, I agree 100%.

  15. Chechens arent even trying to be independent anymore. This wave of nationalism isbad for Russia, and it only happened after the Soviet collapse. See, I guess socialism lets everybody get along. Russians are “alien” to Chechnya? Chechnya, after they ethnically cleansed over a quarter of a million Russians, is now over 90% Chechen. Stop being such a bigot. Muslims are “alien” to Moscow yet theres over a million Muslims in Moscow and only a few thousand Russians in Chechnya. Tell your Muslims brothers and sisters to leave Moscow. As a matter of fact, tell your Muslim brothers and sisters to leave all European nations, since theyre “alien”. We crushed the Chechen rebels, and Chechnya is Russia, now and forever. Chechnya has never been a functioning, independant state, and they never will be. Glory to Russia.

    1. Chechens arent even trying to be independent anymore.
      That is because they have been smashed. Is that shocking. 😀
      Russians are “alien” to Chechnya? Chechnya, after they ethnically cleansed over a quarter of a million Russians, is now over 90% Chechen.
      Definite improvement. 😀
      Stop being such a bigot. Muslims are “alien” to Moscow yet theres over a million Muslims in Moscow and only a few thousand Russians in Chechnya. Tell your Muslims brothers and sisters to leave Moscow. As a matter of fact, tell your Muslim brothers and sisters to leave all European nations, since theyre “alien”. We crushed the Chechen rebels, and Chechnya is Russia, now and forever. Chechnya has never been a functioning, independant state, and they never will be. Glory to Russia.
      “Muslims” ain’t a race, big guy. It’s an ideology.
      They aren’t going to listen to me! 😀

  16. excellents points, johnUK. Im curious though, why would a UK citizen, a Scotsman, be so interested in and and seemingly supportive of Russia? The British have never really been the most Russia-friendly Europeans.

    1. He hates anything with the word “Muslim” even remotely attached to it. He sees them everywhere.
      Sort of like our Glenn Beck.
      In other words, he has a psychological pathology.

  17. @ johnUK and AJ
    first, I am from Iran one of that fuckin muslim country. I am not muslim and I dont believe any fucking religion. thus please dont name me Muslim.
    second, you can’t claim that Russians are good governor to non-Russians. you weren’t in Chechnya to see tyrannical actions of Russians against chechens. this people have fought with Russian occupying and this battle is continuing. if you go there, you will tens of thousand women who have lost their husbands. if this fucking Islam and fucking Saudis didn’t interfere, people of Chechnya had taken their independence. I remind my journey to Baku in 1989 and people of Azerbaijan that because of fear from communists and horrible atmosphere of soviet union, didnt dare to speak about independence but now they are free and independent. and you claim that 90% percent chechens aren’t agreed with independence.
    you werent in situations which chechens and we Iranian people or Iraqis in saddam’s time. here people can’t say their real wills. but with beginning in the 16th century people of Chechnya are fighting against foreign invaders. In the mid-18th century Sheikh Mansur, a Chechen, led a resistance movement against the foreign invaders of the Caucasus. Mansur was captured by Russian forces in 1791 and died several years later. He remains a legendary national hero of the Chechen people.
    they have fought with tsarist Russia, Soviet union and now they are fight with Russia federation. this people are honorable human.

    1. @yashar bugun
      First of all before Russia permanently occupied the region with local support Chechen raiders working on behalf of the Ottoman Empire for 100 years were raiding Russia’s South and Ukraine capturing children and selling women into the Harem sex industry and have always been involved in organized crime and banditry.
      Russia occupied the region to stop Turkish expansionism and aligning themselves with the Ottoman Empire.
      As for the situation in Chechnya it was the regime there that started a mass persecution against ethnic Russians and non-Chechens and centre and haven for organized crime. In fact it was the centre for organized crime in Russia after the fall of the Soviet Union.
      http://conrad2001.narod.ru/english/genocide/genocide_1.htm
      And it is not just Russian’s they fought in Bosnia against the Serbs 91, Afghanistan with the Taliban, Central Asia, Xinjing, Iraq, Nagorno-Karabakhdo, Algeria, Kosovo and probably other places I don’t know about.
      As for Azerbaijan free and independent is a joke.
      The current government there was installed in a Shah like organized coup by British intelligence and BP and worked with international Islamic terrorism as well as Chechen mercenaries in their war against Armenia in the Nagorno-Karabakhdo and a haven for international terrorist like Khattab and Islamic organizations in a proxy war against Russia in Chechnya and the North Caucasus.
      http://www.nlpwessex.org/docs/watscarlett.htm
      “they have fought with tsarist Russia, Soviet union and now they are fight with Russia federation. this people are honorable human.
      Fought for the Ottomans with British and French backing during Tsarist times, British and other foreign lead governments with the western backed Bolshevik civil war, Nazis under the Soviet Union and now the NWO after the collapse of the USSR.

    2. first, I am from Iran one of that fuckin muslim country. I am not muslim and I dont believe any fucking religion. thus please dont name me Muslim.
      Trust me Yashar, “JohnU.K” and “A.J” aren’t going to listen. 🙂
      In their sick world, you will always be a Muslim, the “enemy,” no matter what you say or do.

  18. Chechens are honorable people? Beslan was honorable? You’re sick. I never said 90% of Chechens dont agree with Chechen independence, but most of them dont, and their current government doesnt. There currently is no large-scale Chechen indepedence movement, stop trying to rock the boat. Please show me evidence, like a poll at least, that the majority of Chechens want an independant state. Chechnya was never a nation-state and it will never be a nation-state. Russia is going to protect its territorial integrity, bottom line. Chechnya is not “occupied”, it is part of Russia. Azerbaijan was a seperate republic under the Soviet Union, whereas Chechnya was always part of the Russian part. And what is Azerbaijan now? Another shitty country in Central Asia.

  19. But Bob, Billy Kristol and gang supported Clinton’s barbarous attack on Serbia even as they supported the Chechens and Muslim Slavs, hoping to get militant Islam off Israel’s back a little.

    1. They didn’t do it to get “Militant Islam” off their backs. Hardly. Most of the more rabid Neo-Cons of the time were against the whole operation.
      The Neo-Cons do have a very real fear of an emergent Russia, though.
      It had more to do with U.S dominance and assertion of will in the post Cold War European setting, more than anything else.

  20. Citing: “The shits in Kosovo did that. I support their independence, but they have behaved like total fucks ever since. And also I think the far north of Kosovo, where everyone is Serbian, should have the right to self-determination and splitting from Kosovo. They will probably choose to join Serbia, which is proper and correct.
    The Kosovars acted despicably. They were like, “We have a right to self-determination!” Then we they got it, they ethnically cleansed everyone not a Kosovar Albanian! Damn. And then they decided hypocritically that while minorities in Serbia had a right to split, no minorities in Kosovo would have a right to split! Fuck that.”
    You seem intelligent, you have general knowledge, and what I read about Albanians in general are largely accurate. But for this that I quoted, it seems that you have been driven from your logic, as much from the details (as the Germans say: the devil is hidden in the details), or in the events in the field.
    First of all there were some Serbs that left Kosova after the war, these were all involved in direct crimes on their neighbors, and they don’t feel safe to live there. The others who were cleaned today they enjoy the positive discrimination from both, Serbia and Kosovo.
    What you saidcan not be correct, because the Serbian minority in Kosovo (~ 5%) has constitutional rights more than any other minority in Europe, on the other hand, the Albanians in the region are totally discriminated, regardless of the percentage of them. Why you didnt mention the right for self-determination for the Albanians in Macedonia, Montenegro, Greece, Serbia ?
    Although Albanians are earliest natives in the region, if this fact would have value in the politics, then the Serbian rule: “where one Serb is living, there should be Serbia”, should be in fact naturally available for Albanians, because it is not right that the autochthons become a minority in their own land. The newcomers/invaders may become a minority in a foreign country, but not autochthons, but international politics has divided them into many states, so that’s why we are talking about the problems in this region.

  21. Its not true that Albanians in Kosovo expelled the Serb minority from Kosovo after the war, but some of Serbs escape by themselves because they took part on the massacres against their Albanian neighbors and they did not feel safe after that. Nothing bad was happens to other Serbs who decided to stay, or to the new Serbs who came from Serbia. If you check the constitution of Kosovo, you cannot find any other European country with more liberal laws for minorities than in Kosovo. They were 6-7% of Serbs in Kosovo before the war, and now they are 8%
    Otherwise, in front of Kosovo there are more than 45% Albanians in Macedonia, and they dont have the same rights as Serbs in Kosovo. Double standards, because Albanians can endure as always, and yes since they become majority muslims, Europe (politics) doesn’t like them and divided them in 5 countries around.

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