An Intelligent Comment on Daily Kos

What’s the unemployment rate in California, 15

I’ve seen the Mexican Government issued “Go be a paisano in the US” pamphlets with my own eyes. Maybe they didn’t think an American who could read Spanish would ever see them, but the pamphlet was telling the poor to go “retake the American southwest”. That’s a fact.

So the California Latino voter knows there is far more poverty in Mexico than there are jobs in California. It doesn’t do them any good to bring in more cheap labor and get tossed into the unemployment line, and then be just as poor as they were originally when their unemployment benefits run out.

We really need to stop this race based political thinking. Does the fact that I have Greek ancestry mean that I want the whole of Greece immigrating over here without the jobs to support them? No, so why would a Latino trying to hang on to his job want that either?

Illegal Immigration supports two groups of people. The CEO’s trying to exploit them for cheap labor, and the politicians trying to exploit them for votes. Everyone else knows they’re being scammed.

This is a great comment. Predictably, it was pummeled by the next four commenters. The last one told him to shut up, as Daily Kos is a pro-immigration reform (amnesty) site. Daily Kos represents the Left wing of the Democratic Party. Those four comments that followed were quite predictable, and it shows why the liberal-Left in the US is absolute shit.

Let’s go over this comment bit by bit. It’s quite possible that unemployment is over 10

I can tell you from personal experience here in California that the illegal alien tidal wave has had a disastrous effect on working class Americans. My friends were all Whites, so I can only speak to its effect on working class Whites. But I don’t see why it hasn’t hurt working class Hispanics and Blacks too. At the very least, it has glutted the low wage labor market and nuked wages down to a very low level.

It’s an absolute effect that the sickening rightwing Mexican elite uses illegal immigration as a cynical way to dump their poor on us. Poor that in any decent society they ought to be taking care of. But Mexico is an extreme class society that at its base is very rightwing.

The rich in Mexico, via the state, spend about as much on health, education and whatnot as the Haitian state does. They are just another evil 3rd World elite that has turned its country into a shithole by refusing to share with the rest. Like India, like the rest of Latin America, like the Philippines, like Indonesia.

That the US Liberal-Left fully supports the rightwing scum elite in Mexico in this rightwing and deeply anti-progressive project (shoving millions of their poor up here so they don’t have to create a decent society in Mexico) is infuriating. Why is the Liberal-Left in the US supporting a bunch of rightwing shits in Mexico? But you will never hear one single peep about this on the US Liberal-Left. One can only conclude that they are in bed with the Mexican elite in this game.

Similarly, the poster notes that the pamphlets that the Mexican government hands out that explicitly urge its citizens to go to the US also openly tell them to “retake the Southwest.” This shows that the Mexican elite is the enemy of America, and that Mexico is in a sense an enemy state.

It’s an enemy state because it continues to lay claims on the US Southwest. When you go to school in Mexico, you get a steady diet of revanchist propaganda about how the US Southwest is really a part of Mexico. 58

The poster also points out the insanity of race-based politics for California Latinos. Your average working class Latino citizen is not helped by the illegal flood. You can make a good case that he is harmed by them, and that illegals throw a lot of California Latinos out of work too. So why do California Latinos support illegals? Loyalty to La Raza. Your race trumps your pocketbook if you’re a Chicano? Wow.

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47 thoughts on “An Intelligent Comment on Daily Kos”

  1. I believe that there was an emerging ideological synthesis between the so-called “left” and the plutocratic elite in the post-Cold War era that has led to such moments today. The “fascists” are the only pro-worker alternative in the world today.

  2. To Robert:

    Predictably, it was pummeled by the next four commenters.

    Well yes of course… hate facts should always be condemned.

  3. Sanctions against employers are effectively zero.

    This is a bigger issue. More important that any fence. How long would it take to rebuild a fence anyway? We could get things done much faster sanctions against emploers were inforced becuase there are laws on the books. They just aren’t being enforced.

  4. Leftists want illegal immigrants for future votes, and also in order to weaken whites and lend further legitimacy to their anti-racist arguments (ie. I frequently hear Tim Wise type anti-racists say, “as the U.S becomes more ‘of color’ we’ll need to make serious changes”).

    After all, the more non-white the U.S becomes, the more you have to enact policies that help them, right?

    Neocons and conservatives want illegals for cheap labor.

    The key is to go after employers and leftist elites who tolerate this crap.

    1. Look, I agree with a few things Tim Sise has said but do ever think the guy is just writing what he writes because he makes a lot of money doing it? Come on BAG, you weren’t born yesterday. Wise don’t = Jesus stop giving him so much room in your head.

      1. Good point.

        The best way to deal with those types is simply to ridicule and ignore them.

        Perhaps I should try to do that.

        1. that would be your best bet. By mentioning him, you’ve introduced him to a number of readers here who’ve never heard of him and probably helped wise sell a few books on Amazon or the local libary.

  5. Well, Bob I believe you just talked your way into forming a “Left” White (national Socialist- Bolshevik or Communist) organization. If “your race trumps your pocketbook if your’re a Chicano”
    but the American lib-left’s racelessness trumps its pocketbook and its nation….hmmm.

    1. National Communism is ok. Screw the rest of it. I don’t like nationalism. Patriotism si, nationalism no. People on the Left are usually pretty damned dubious about nationalism. It’s just so shitty, rightwing and backwards so much of the time. Nationalism turns sane, modern humans into club-wielding, grunting cavemen.

  6. “Illegal Immigration supports two groups of people. The CEO’s trying to exploit them for cheap labor, and the politicians trying to exploit them for votes. Everyone else knows they’re being scammed.”

    Kos left out the most important group- illegal immigration supports illegal immigrants. Individually, the will to immigrate is great. Individually, the will to keep out illegal immigrants is small.

    Throw in the dwindling demographics of white Americans, and the will gets smaller every year.

    But thanks for playing, Kos. A shout out to you, in the vacuum of cyberspace!

  7. “Your average working class Latino citizen is not helped by the illegal flood. You can make a good case that he is harmed by them, and that illegals throw a lot of California Latinos out of work too. So why do California Latinos support illegals? Loyalty to La Raza. Your race trumps your pocketbook if you’re a Chicano? Wow.”

    They probably have friends or relatives who are illegals. So their support of illegals are understandable. Besides, the impact of illegals on their livelihood is gradual, which doesn’t have the same psychological effect as taking, let’s say $5000, out of their bank account abruptly.

    And illegals can’t be good for blacks. As illegals flood the market, it’s harder for them to get a decent-paying job. But Many blacks, for some reason, are strong supporters of illegals. For instance, Mass. Governor Deval Patrick, who is black and proponent of illegals, pledged to give state college scholarship to illegals.

    1. Your regular black folks are quite strongly against illegal immigration. But the the black politicians are democrats first and they must tow the democratic party line on immigration.

  8. 1) The unemployment rate is way higher than 10%. If you include those that have given up looking, ran out of unemployment insurance and no longer are counted for the stats, the number would skyrocket from there. Then you count the people who are under-employed, like recent college grads working at Home Depot. Then you count the huge underground economy made up by “undocumented” types and I wouldn’t be surprised if the figure was between 20-25%. Now on top of that, let’s talk about people who ARE employed but due to the economy are scared to ask for raises to keep up with the cost of living and it makes that 10% figure look like a joke.

    Illegal Immigration supports two groups of people. The CEO’s trying to exploit them for cheap labor, and the politicians trying to exploit them for votes. Everyone else knows they’re being scammed.

    It also supports a 3rd group, the people you guys call cultural marxists who have unwavering belief in diversifying America and use immigration as a tool to do so. These people are liberal/leftist and don’t like the right-wing economic elite and view the world’s unwashed masses knocking on the door as their brothers in arms with whom they hope to forge some sort of worldwide social democracy.

    I am not against diversity by any means, or immigration either. I have friends of just about every type of background. I just don’t view it as something that should be forced upon a society if they don’t want it because you are causing more problems in the long run. Nor do I think diversity is always 100% good(or bad for that matter). Liberals view the desirability of diversity and immigration as axiomatic. Homogeneous societies seem to get along just fine. I don’t see Japanese lamenting that there aren’t enough non-Japanese in Japan.

    My policy is:

    1) Eliminate illegal immigration.

    2) Border enforcement.

    3) ID checks for all workers

    4) Verify status of all people using tax paid services like schools and hospitals.

    5) Give police in ALL states the right to verify citizenship just like the law in Arizona.

    6) No more anchor babies. Revise the Constitution. If you come here illegally in the 8th month of pregnancy and have your kid here, your kid does not automatically become a citizen.

    7) If someone has been living in the U.S. illegally for many years with kids enrolled in the school and they seem settled in here, I’m willing to give them a path to citizenship, I’m not completely heartless about it.

    8) Revise family reunification laws. Just because one guy comes here doesn’t mean his entire family should have the right to come.

    9) I would allow a guest worker program if employers can truly demonstrate that Americans won’t take that job AT A COMPETITIVE LIVING WAGE.

    10) Migrant guest workers here would have the full protections that any U.S. workers have. They will not be exploited and they will be paid a living wage.

    Now when are we going to enact Tulio’s immigration reform plan?

    1. Lol, the eight and the right parenthesis was auto-converted into a smiley!

      I forgot number 11, stiff fines for all employers hiring illegal workers.

    2. I agree with all except for 4 and 7.

      4. Kids need to be educated in school, whether they are here legally or not. Such education ends at the 12th grade. Also, hospitals must treat all persons whether they are here legally or not. I agree with the pro-illegals on that stuff.

      7. I want to throw all the illegals out. If you keep the ones who have already had anchor babies, well, that’s a good 90% of them. I live with these people. This place is like an aquarium full of illegal alien fishes. The overwhelming majority of the illegals around here seem to have kids with them, and you seem to meet anchor babies all the time. Keep in mind that since 1990, 85% of immigrants from Mexico to the US have been illegals. So when you meet all these kids 20-under who speak fluent Spanish (because they grew up in a Spanish-speaking home) but also speak fluent English, the vast majority of them are probably the children of illegals. Around here it is very common to see parents of kids ranging 1-23 or so who speak little or no English. The kids are English-fluent. In some cases, the parents are legal immigrants (green card) but in many cases, they are simply illegals.

      9. I am for a guest worker program for agriculture. But they can never be legalized. I don’t think enough legals or citizens will do that work.

      1. There are actually are some illegals that have been here for years, have bought houses somehow, even somehow manage to work regular middle class jobs and have families and lives here and have lived here for decades. Throwing them out of the country is too draconian for me, but we need to stop it happening further.

        My main problem with the “path to citizenship” crap that the major parties talk about is that it doesn’t do much about enforcement. Enforce the laws first, get more surveillance at the border, then we can talk about what to do with the people here. But the democrats and repubs just want another Reagan type amnesty and we’ll find ourselves right back at the table again in a few years with yet another amnesty bill in proposal.

        1. I used to believe this until I moved into a city full of damned illegals. Now I want them all out of here. TONS of them buy homes. TONS. LOTS of them have been here forever. I have no sympathy for them anymore. They made so much $ they can live like kings in Mexico anyway.

          What’s wrong with going back to Mexico. That’s where they came from, right? MEXICO? That’s, like, their country? What’s so inhumane about making Mexican citizens go back to their homeland?

  9. Hey Robert, have you ever heard of the Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Act that was passed in 2007? Are you sure free speech isn’t endangered in this sorry excuse for a country?

  10. Is your rationalization for kicking out all the illegals primarily driven by nationalism (saving the jobs and high living standards of the United States for its “natives”) or internationalism (the (somewhat dubious in my opinion) notion that a “safety valve” into the United States for masses of the impoverished underclass discourages economic development and alleviation of poverty within Mexico)?


    “National communism is okay.”
    says Bob, then proceeds to contradict himself.
    You’re either a nationalist commie or a trotskyite.
    Zyuganov was a nationalist communist and the Zionists and liberal internationalsits despised

        1. No, not at all. I don’t see why Communists have to be anti-Semites. What’s up with that, anyway? There’s a long and glorious history of Jewish participation in Russian Communism. Hell, without the Jews, it never would have happened. What’s with the anti-Semitic crap? I mean, I wish them luck and all, but can the anti-Semitism, will ya?

          You can also be a Bolivarian like Chavez. He, Correa, and Morales are strong nationalists. So is Raul Castro. They are all strong nationalists, and they’re also Leftists. No contradiction at all. The Laotians and Viet Commies are the same way. Very nationalist. So are the Nepalese and Indian Maoists. It’s only the Western Left that is into destroying their own countries.

      1. I never did understand the need by some to include anti-Semitic thought with communism, or at least fraudulently coordinate the two. It is very popular on the right, here in the U.S now days. It is almost as though they are focusing their own deep and dark feelings onto the plight of others that they are ideologically opposed to.

        On the contrary, coming from a family of communists and left leaning types, Jewish folks were instrumental and respected in that political and economic movement. I had Jewish folks marry into my large family as a result. Hell, my on Father, a complete “goyim,” was in a Jewish frat in college.

        I don’t understand the “recent right’s” sort of weird connection of the two.

  12. Amazing to think that this was actually posted on The Daily Kos.

    Was this written by Markos Moulitsas himself?

    1. No, Markus writes like .00001% of the material on there. That was just a comment on a thread about the California elections.

      Anyway, Markus is a super-liberal who is pro-amnesty. 🙁

  13. Dugin’s latest stance unless revised in the past few months, is that Putin will have to do until the now more or less apolitical Russians grow adequately dissatisifed with the moderately-to-be-preferred Putinesque “nationalist capitalism” (over the e.g American variety.)

    1. I do not mind the “state capitalism” of Russia and China these days. It’s way better than internationalist multinational corporate neoliberalism, which only just wrecks the homeland in addition to destroying other nations. Their state capitalism is patriotic, good for the country, involves tons of state spending, is socialist in many ways, looks out of the good of the people, and does not seek to destroy other nations in an imperialist or financial capitalist manner.

      Pretty good stuff for 2010! I like it.

        1. I don’t know about that, anon. I don’t go for classic 1930’s fascism, sorry. No pasaran!

          If you want to call the Russian and Chinese economies fascist, well, be my guest.


    No, Lindsay. As Israel Shamir points out here and is attacked for it, presumably by a raceless “marxist”…neither Stalin nor Zyuganov
    were/are biological anti-semites, but were socialist Nationalists who opposed Jewry’s influence as a seperatist cultural-national entity!!!!

    If you read Gennadi on the subject you will never be able to pin him down as a biological ant-semite.

    1. And Shamir is a horrible anti-Semite, notwithstanding the fact that he is a great writer with many insights. His specialty is the socialism of fools (socialist anti-Semitism). Truly idiotic!

      1. I hate capitalism
      2. Jews are capitalists
      3. Get rid of the Jews, get rid of capitalism
      4. Fail. Gentile capitalists take over for the Jews
      5. But they are different, they are “good capitalists.”
      6. Yeah right!

      It’s so retarded, I can’t believe anyone falls for it.

  15. Bob says nationalism is ethnonationalism.
    Well, there are many issues involved with “nationalism”—the paleocons over at Chronicles Magazine say they are patriots and want nothing to do with nationalism, for example.

    But assuming one is pro-nationalist, there comes immediately into question the degree of biological similarity among indigenous groups necessary to form a spiritual ethnos harmony. History says it must be high. So of course there is a biological component, as Strasser said to Hitler, a building-block at the foundation of Spiritual Race/Nation which of course then transcends the actual building block and admits a certain degree of expanded biolgicoal dissimilarity as it Creates the Noble Aristocracy Culture Bearing of the Nation.

    But of course the Foundational Core must be retained and must be highly homogenous.

  16. Israel Shamir, last I checked, converted to Russian Orthodoxy as culmination of a journey in which he had already shed Jewish identity formally.

    In declaring himself an ex-Jew he was thumbing his nose at supposed rabbinical power to decide and/or create Jewish identity, a power which is mythical, myths of course becoming true in a Hegelian Historical sense, but also defiable.

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