Don’t believe racists when they say they dislike Black people.
Black people and what makes them tick are their favorite topic. They can’t get enough of talking about Blacks, looking at images of Blacks, or analyzing Blacks.
What if there were a group of people you didn’t like? Suppose they had all kinds of character flaws that made them almost impossible to like. Because of this, you wanted nothing to do with them, and you could live happily ever after never running into another one again.
Why would you ever be seen in public discussing them as if they were the most fascinating object in the world? Why would you care what made them tick? Isn’t it enough that they are inferior and to be avoided as much as possible?
If you were serious about having nothing to do with them, you would be getting your affairs in order so as to get out of anyplace that had any significant number of them. Your behavior would show that they’re serious. After all, White Flight isn’t anything new.
Right now, I’m thinking of this person I don’t like. And you know something? I don’t want anything to do with him! I don’t care why he is the way he is. I don’t devote a lot of time to analyzing him and going over his faults with other people. If he dropped off the face of the earth, I wouldn’t miss him. Because I don’t like him.
I have no interest in persuading other people not to like him. I have no desire to sit around with other people making fun of him or debating why he is as awful as he is. Because I don’t like him. I have better, more interesting things to do.
But racists have a lot of time to spend on studying a group of people they supposedly dislike and want nothing to do with. Black people are supposed to be innately inferior, right? If so, why do you care why we do what we do? Why would you seek out multiple opportunities to discuss Black behavior and look at videos of Black behavior, and why is Black behavior so fascinating and entertaining to you?
I don’t think this is the way you act toward people you want nothing to do with and cannot stand. So why do you pay so much attention to Blacks? What do you want?
"Why Are You So Fascinated by People You Can't Stand?" by Alpha Unit
Don’t believe racists when they say they dislike Black people.
59 thoughts on “"Why Are You So Fascinated by People You Can't Stand?" by Alpha Unit”
Easier said than done. I think there is an morbid, nearly pathological urge to justify
our hatered by watching people we hate in their more revolting attitudes and behaviours. We, europeans cannot just ignore the arabs because the threat they represent to our freedom and way of life is much too real and growing by the day.
Because they need an answer to the accusation that their attitude is based simply on skin color. Until 50 years ago, it was accepted that in areas with large black populations that whites would segregate. Then the federal government decreed that such a system violated our Constitution and values (and the government was right.)
Near where I live, there are nice, safe white neighborhoods and crummy, dangerous black ones. To be able to say “Why ask why; just keep them separate” would work for a lot of people, but that’s illegal (and should be). HBD is about saying “the difference isn’t just the color of their skin; there are other differences that drive behavior, and the history of oppression, that implies a debt on the part of whites, isn’t the only one.”
Jared Taylor of Amren makes the important point that it isn’t pleasant to have to talk about black inferior behavior, probably driven by genetics, but there’s no other way to get out of the argument “differences in black behavior are the result of legacies of oppression, and if you say it’s due to culture, then that culture is due to the legacies of oppression.” This leads to things like No Child Left Behind, which narrowed school cirricula away from developing gifted students and toward narrowing racial gaps. If that’s a waste of money, how do we avoid it if the people in control accept the equality of genetics assumption and hence that gap narrowing represents a societal debt obligation.
But, maybe this could be moment for positive teachability. If a racialist is constrained by employment to live in a diverse metropolitan area, perhaps you could give some hints to limit their exposure to undesirable black behavior?
People are certainly free to get together with like-minded others and talk about whatever they want. But you referred to a “need” that racists/racialists have to answer an accusation that their attitude is based on skin color. Why do they need to answer anything? Are they insecure?
Is this the attitude of adults? “I need to be able to justify my beliefs to others who might judge me for having them”?
If you live in a diverse metropolitan area, it seems to me you would be interested in how to limit your exposure to undesirable behavior PERIOD, whether it’s from blacks or whites or whomever. Is black undesirable behavior harder to deal with than white undesirable behavior?
But you referred to a “need” that racists/racialists have to answer an accusation that their attitude is based on skin color. Why do they need to answer anything? Are they insecure?
Because negative attitudes toward ethnic groups is an opinion our society does not treat with respect. Like most products of the American education system, I was taught growing up that negative attitudes toward blacks were prejudices (pre-judgements) based on ignorance (not knowing them). My attitude toward blacks became more negative AFTER I got to know more of them BETTER. So, I’ve come to the conclusion that a naive belief in equality-of-behavior is actually the pre-judgement based on ignorance.
Let’s try a thought experiment. Imagine the people who call themselves race-realists are right, and that blacks have a genetically lower IQ than whites, with ramifications in lower academic success, economic achievement and social behavior. Now lets assume that the socio-politically dominant members of society either believe the opposite or have a motive to act like they do, so that politics, media and social convention is dominated by platitudes that it’s society’s fault that black achievement is so much lower and their behavior demonstrably inferior. What should the believers in lower black IQ do?
They show examples of blacks demonstrating inferior behavior as proof that all else is not equal. We COULD possibly ignore black’s inferior behavior, if our society permitted us to quietly and privately act on those beliefs. But we’re so full of diversity initiatives, civil rights principals, rules against disparate impacts, and social conventions to pretend otherwise; that race realists are under a burden of proof to demonstrate our position.
So you live in a society in which negative attitudes toward ethnic groups is an opinion our society does not treat with respect, you say. Is there some kind of right to have one’s views validated? In just about any society, there are certain views that might result in some kind of social penalty if you express them out loud.
You have choices. You can express your unpopular views and accept the consequences. You can keep your views to yourself and focus on what’s really important in your life – the same thing countless minorities have had to do in hostile environments.
You can try to change the rules of society by making your case with legislatures and courts, the way minorities have done before in this country.
Or you can go somewhere your views wouldn’t be in the minority – again, a move made throughout history by groups who found life intolerable where they were.
These are the ways adults have handled this kind of adversity.
Yeah, bad Blacks are harder to deal with than bad Whites. First of all, Whites are not so difficult. Also, I am used to dealing with White people and I know how to deal with even some pretty tough and sleazy seeming Whites. They’re often friendly if you know how to deal with them, but I doubt if it’s a good idea to get too involved with them. Bad Whites are often just failures, into slobbery, drugs, sloppiness and being disgusting people. We had some people living next door to us like that.
They were speed freaks who threw parties that lasted all nite long. They went out on the balcony to cuss and spit all nite long. We’d go out in the morning and there would be spit and cigarette butts on my car. Their friends would come over, drunk, and leave a pile of spilled food on the balcony. They were scumbags, but you could deal with them.
They were just disgusting people. They were not trying to annoy us or spit and throw stuff on my car, that’s just where their projectiles ended up.
First thing about White scumbags is to treat them with respect. Try to be as friendly to them as possible. If you’re hostile, they don’t like it, and they may turn on you. Even if they’re scumbags, you act real friendly anyway just to stay on good terms. Plus being openly hostile is sort of a violation of White society values.
What I noticed moving out here to this Hispanic zone is that there are like 3 times more bad people than in a White area and the bad people act about 3 times worse than White bad actors.
I’m guessing, but it seems like if you went to a Black area, there would be 8 times as many bad actors, and they would act 8 times worse than your average White bad actor.
So, yeah, bad Blacks are harder to deal with.
For instance, around here, we have pimps and street whores. Almost all of them are Black, and Blacks are only 4% of town. Pimps are street whores really outrage me. We also have Blacks around here who look out and out dangerous. I’m not sure how dangerous they are, but they scare the Hell out of me because they look so ghetto and gangster. Some of them have those metal teeth in the mouths (grills).
I don’t have anything to do with them, but there’s something really outrageous about ghetto Blacks to us Whites. It really hits you on a gut level. I mean, there are some tough, hardass and even dangerous looking Whites here, but not that many.
It’s kind of hard to describe. I guess the thing is we know how to deal with bad Whites. Those are our people, we know them well. Most of them can be accommodated. We don’t know how to deal with bad Blacks. That’s like a whole other really scary universe way beyond anything we are used to, and they seem so much worse to us. Plus they seem kind of unpredictable. Bad Whites are not unpredictable. It’s easy to deal with them, just don’t piss them off, be respectful and don’t get involved with them.
So Whites don’t know how to deal with bad Blacks. They deal with them the same way Black people used to have to deal with bad, scary Whites, and the way other groups have had to deal with bad, scary people.
Are Whites really this pathetic?
I guess the thing is that bad Whites are our own people, and I know how to deal with my own people, even bikers, speed freaks, speed dealers, meth cooks, you name it. I’ve dealt with them all. It’s all knowing how to deal with people.
I think we are not used to bad Blacks, so we don’t know how to deal with them. It makes sense, really. You know your own kind better than others.
Also, to me, bad Blacks just seem more dangerous and less predictable.
I can also deal with bad Hispanics and bad Amerindians cuz I know how to deal with them too. Hispanics can be a bit tricky at times, but you can still deal with them.
Neither of these groups seem as dangerous and unpredictable as bad Blacks. There’s some kind of crazy and violent aspect to bad Blacks that to me makes them really hard to deal with and figure out . I can’t seem to read them, figure out where they are coming from, or figure out some way to deal with them to minimize my chances of having a bad experience.
I hear what you’re saying, Robert. And what a lot of Whites don’t seem to realize is that the same feeling of “These people are dangerous and unpredictable” was a feeling generations of Blacks had toward Whites, and for good damned reason.
Yet somehow Blacks made it. They coped with what could sometimes be a bad situation in a hostile environment. Now these “race realists” somehow expect to be coddled.
“People won’t like us if we say how we really feel,” they say. Deal with it the way everybody else in your situation dealt with it.
When you’re White, you learn the social rules of White society. This takes years or decades, but after a while, you figure it out, then you can deal.
Right now my neighbors are hanging out on the porch. There are some Mexican gangbanger types and even worse, it looks like some of the local young Black guys. I’m just not even going to go over there; it seems like “trouble.” Also, yeah, I don’t know how to deal with them.
Now, if there were a bunch of really hardcore badass White bikers over there, I could probably deal, because I know how to act around them. First, I have to go into my super macho badass hypermasculine mode so they don’t think I’m a fag, a pussy or a wimp. Also, I am going to completely respect them, 100%. There’s a certain distance you stand away from guys and a certain way you treat them.
There are rules about whether I should talk to them first or they me. There are eye movements, facial expressions and so many things expressed nonverbally. When I start talking, there are things to say and things not to say. When they answer back, there are right and wrong ways to answer back. I would be over there reading all those rules all the time and trying to figure out how to act and what to say. But I can deal with these folks because I’ve had decades of experience with them.
Now, for all I know, the social rules and whatnot may be quite a bit different with badass Black types. I don’t have much experience dealing with them and I don’t understand their game very well, so they frighten and confuse me.
It makes perfects sense. It’s not pathetic at all, AU.
You learn how to deal with your own kind. Different ethnic groups? Maybe you don’t feel you have learned how to deal with them, if they can even be dealt with at all.
While I’m sure there are some white nationalists that would rather not spend a second thinking about blacks, you do have the other type. Robert pointed out that group called niggermania. I didn’t bother to even go to the group as I have no interest in doing so. You have a certain segment of white racist that seem obsessed with black people to a degree that I think it’s become a psychosis. I remember back in the mid 90s, I was a regular poster in an african american usenet group. by the early 2000s, it was overtaken by trolls. People why flooded the group with photos of blacks being lynched, writing long stream of consciousness posts about their fantasies of annihilating blacks. Some of these people it was clear were pretty sick. Within a couple years, the group was inundated with racist white trolls that they were now the majority of posters and most the black long time posters simply moved on. The racists were the same types that would go to a site called niggermania. The type who woke up in the morning thinking about black people like some crusader that has vowed lifelong revenge on his enemy and lives for no other reason. Psychologically, I’m not sure what’s going on there, but if they hate us that much, why don’t they just leave us alone?
That’s the question I have: if you don’t like Black people, why do you dwell on them so much? I don’t understand the glee some of these racists have in discussing bad behavior among Blacks when it’s caught on video, for example. It’s almost as if they’re little kids jumping up and down crying, “See? Told you they were horrible!”
This just isn’t adult behavior. These people seem to be in a state of arrested development or something.
The thing is, they are obsessed with Blacks because they hate them. What I’ve noticed is that a lot of Whites are uncomfortable with talk about say bad Black behavior. A lot of these folks even thing there are differences between the races, but they don’t think it’s all that important. If you like Blacks, you really don’t want to think about racial differences or bad Black behavior because the more you think and talk about this stuff, it has a tendency to make you start disliking Blacks. And if you like them, you don’t want to get your head into a place where you are disliking them.
This is really what is going in most liberal PC thinking. These thoughts and conversations lead to ill will towards Blacks, and they don’t want to get their minds going in that direction. Rather than beng PC-Commie freaks, they just don’t want to have a lot of hostile feelings towards certain ethnic groups. One of the ways of staying positive about a group is to focus on good thoughts and conversation about them and limit bad thoughts and conversation.
With the folks who are obsessed with Blacks negatively, the reason is that they hate Blacks. The more they hate Blacks, the more obsessed they are with them. So the obsession is just a marker for racist hatred. Hatred need not be dismissive as AU suggests, hatred can also be quite obsessive.
I got into anti-Semitism for a while until I realized I was going nuts and pulled myself out of it. I literally got up in the morning thinking about Jews. I talked about Jews all the time and thought about them all the time. They were the cause of so many problems. This type of thinking really does have an obsessive quality and it’s easy to get into it. I pulled out of the anti-Semitism, I think, and now I look back and feel like I was mentally ill during that time.
The other main thing is that these people think that Blacks or Jews or whoever are *really important.* I’m going to be a dick and say that Blacks, Jews, etc. are not really important. Jews are important if you’re a Palestinian. Maybe Blacks are important if you live in Zimbabwe or South Africa. But for most of us, these groups are not important. One of the worst things about anti-Semitism is that it assigns all this importance to Jews and Jews don’t deserve it. They’re just some pissant little tribe of humans and at the end of the day, they don’t effect my life all that much.
In the same way, these folks really exaggerate the problems of Blacks. Yeah, Blacks cause problems, mostly for their own long suffering kind! To give you the example of my town, we have a lot of ghetto Blacks around here, but I pretty much stay clear of them, and these people mean nothing to me and have no effect on my life, other than they are somewhat disturbing/disgusting to look at. But there are disgusting people everywhere, so I can deal.
I definitely understand better where you are coming from now, Robert. I used to have the anti-semitism bug too, mainly because I had the conspiracy-theory bug from reading too much Rense and Henry Makow, but I digress. I’ll be straight up honest. I could give a fuck if blacks even existed. But, since they do, unfortunately, I try to go out of my way as to dampen their, as you say, “unpredictability.” Let’s use some numbers to illustrate why I’m so “prejudiced.”
Let’s say I’ve come into contact personally with 10,000 people in my life (just a round #). Okay, since I live in the South, 15% of those are black, so 1,500. Supposing that the “Others” I’ve encountered are statistically insignificant (less than 2% Asian, Native American, etc.), the other 83% or so were white. Obviously I’ve had some rough run-ins with some nasty upper-middle class whites and some trailer folk, but they only constitute about 2% of my encounters, ~200 people. And I’ve had bad encounters with 3x as many blacks, so ~600. My bad encounter quotient for whites would then be approximately 0.024 and for blacks it would be a whopping 0.4!
So while my brain has been busy detecting patterns of the social fabric of my community, it has, correctly, zeroed in on a trait which statistically favors a “bad encounter.” It’s not foolproof, of course, the other 60% of my encounters with blacks were either positive or neutral, but the 40% have seriously muddied the waters.
White racists have always existed, unfortunately, so Blacks learned early how to dampen their “unpredictability.” I guess it’s something every group has to learn to do.
I got into an anti-semetic stage a few weeks ago
Mainly because of my mother, who is a lying greedy money obsessed bastard, said she wanted to convert to judiasm.
I thought of the jewish sterotypes, saw how they conformed to her, then in my mind “those fucking jew lying rats”
What’s interesting is that for non-blacks I know who generally like blacks, that is, they have black friends, date black people(even if no exclusively), enjoy listening to people like Cornel West and black music for example, they are not oblivious to the fact that there are a lot of social problems in the black community. What I notice however is that they deal with it the same way black people deal with the same reality.
Trust me, black people can be some of the harshest critics of blacks when whites aren’t listening. Chris Rock even made his famous comedy routine based on this when he said, “I love black people, but I hate niggas(what you would consider ghetto black people)!” For the non-blacks I know that are “down with black people”, for example, Hispanic girls I know that like black men, they will be the first to say that many black men are players, but they are shooting for a good black man, pretty much the same attitude a typical black woman has. Black women don’t say don’t look at all these Jared Taylor statistics and conclude they need to stay away from black men, they just know that they need to stay away from the ghetto/thuggish types, and that they are one segment of the black community, not all of it.
For whites that have no intimate or personal connection to black people, this dynamic doesn’t exist. They view blacks as pretty much a monolith. They speak of blacks in terms of “those people” or “you people”. Whereas non-blacks who have close personal connections to blacks are more likely to judge them as individuals as they know there is wide variation in personality and temperament as there is with any group. That doesn’t mean they don’t notice group differences. Like I said, some of the Hispanic women I know that like black guys(or at least are open to dating them) are not shy about saying bad things about certain types of black guys with the thug thing going on. They just don’t see blacks as all cut from the same cloth. Liberals see groups differences just like race realists, I think the difference is how they react to them, and how important they view the individual over what group they belong to, as well as acknowledge positive things about a certain culture while still recognizing that there’s bad. They have enough positive experiences from blacks to know that you have to judge us as individuals first. They will also have a more keen sense of who the true ghetto blacks are and who are not.
I think many whites that aren’t familiar with the intricacies of black culture can’t distinguish well between blacks who are troublemakers and those that aren’t. Just like you described how to deal with bikers and understand how to talk to them, read their language and expressions, many of us are the same way with fellow blacks. Some black kids are harmless, but sport the hiphop look and that terrifies whites who equate the hiphop look with thuggery. After awhile you can tell the real troublemakers from the guys who aren’t trouble but maybe sport that look just to look “cool” or get attention from girls.
Let me give you an example. I used to be buddies with this white guy. He never came out and said it, but I could kinda tell he wasn’t too crazy about Hispanics. There was a local restaurant near us that had a happy hour that I would frequent. I recommended it to him. He later told me he went and talked about how many “vatos” were there and said “I’m glad I made it out of there alive.” I was telling one of my buddies about this(he’s half white and half Salvadorean, but looks white), and he thought it was pretty ridiculous. While the spot was frequented by mostly Mexicans, they were harmless. Some of them did sport the shaved head look that might be scary to whites, but I know enough about Mexicans to tell which are the real gangbangers you stay away from and which just like the shaved head look to get the girls and aren’t any problem. The white dude just didn’t understand the difference, due to his lack of exposure to that culture.
I will agree with you on one thing though. The black thugs are definitely worst than the Hispanic or white ones as far as predictability. I don’t know about on order of 8x. But I’d rather have to deal with a Latino gangbanger than a black one. Obviously I wouldn’t want to run across a bunch of Nazi skinheads at night by myself (that would trouble!), but as far as biker type meth dealer whites, I’m not worried about them and they aren’t worried about me.
Whites who have little familiarity see blacks as a monolith. Maybe it’s time they got over that.
There’s just a different psychology between the “blacks as a monolith” mindset and the “blacks as diverse individuals(heterolith?)” mindset. The thing is, both groups are “race realists” in a sense. Even the people I know who are most open and accepting towards blacks would prefer not to live in an all black area, so they are not oblivious as racists think they are. They just recognize that while there are group generalizations, blacks are too individually varied to discount them all and that in our day to day life, we deal with unique human beings, not statistical abstractions. They don’t view social problems as being exclusive to blacks, and don’t view virtue as being exclusive to whites. They also tend to have aspects of black culture that they enjoy, such as jazz, soul, hip-hop or reggae music, fashion sense, or enjoy black people’s sense of comedy or manner of expression, some may find an appreciation of the black struggle and are sympathetic with it, or any number of things. They don’t view the culture through an utterly negative lens like the white racists.
In John Derbyshire’s recent book, We’re All Doomed, he points out that almost no schools in the country are between 25 and 90% black and Hispanic. Once the percent crosses 25, virtually all the whites leave, dropping housing prices and enticing more blacks and Hispanics. It’s like the first 25% of minorities are diversity; the rest bring down quality.
I think the issue with intelligent race realists is that our society has many initiatives designed to help blacks that are not contingent on improving their pathologies. Which is a bigger problem for blacks today, the legacy of slavery or 70% fatherlessness? How come none of our diversity-type initiatives are ever justified on the grounds of “this will help blacks by reducing fatherlessness”?
The outlets of elite opinion (colleges and media) are forever spouting ideas and concerns about overcoming “racism” in our society, on the assumption that it’s at the root of observed socio-economic disparities. Everyone knows there are other behaviorily-rooted causes, and that any real solutions will have to address those, but we don’t. Hence, the need for detailed examination of black behavior that AU has pointed out.
Why is there any further need for “detailed examination” of black behavior, though? Are blacks some kind of special beings whose behavior is especially hard to fathom?
I agree with you that fatherlessness is a major problem for children and families. Does this need further study? There’s no way to force people to be responsible fathers, so what more can race realists do about this problem?
I don’t agree that after the minority ratio hits 25%, all the Whites take off. For instance, my city. It is 67% Hispanic and about 27% White. It’s a majority Hispanic city, but the Whites are still here. Whites will generally live with even large numbers of Hispanics as long as the place isn’t too thrashed. Now if this city was 67% Black, that would be a whole new ballgame, I’m afraid.
The big problem with race realists is that they are utterly negative and offer no solutions whatsoever to racial problems. Look at Amren. That’s a big venue. What’s their solution? Get rid of all civil rights and anti-discrimination laws, affirmative action and end all non-White immigration. And that’s like the major, semi-respectable outlet. Oh, and White separatism. WTF man? Those aren’t solutions for anything, except maybe the affirmative action thing. None of those things are ever going to come to pass, forget it. They’ve painted themselves into Loon Corner.
Looks like almost all HBD’ers offer some kind of “solutions” like this. Almost all of them are libertarians. Of course getting rid of all anti-discrimination and civil rights laws flows right from Libertarianism.
Clearly, the PC anti-racist crowd is full of crap. All of the problems of minorities are due to White Supremacy, White Privilege, etc. It’s all garbage, but it’s not like the race realists are coming up with anything better.
Everyone knows that lots of Black people act bad, and most would agree that there’s way more bad actors in the Black community and the bad actors act way worse than other groups.
Black people get their backs up whenever people start talking like this, but it’s something that Blacks should deal with. Racists are not completely insane and evil people. Face it, a lot of non-Blacks are racist almost entirely due to the number and virulence of the bad actors in the Black community. If Blacks acted better, a lot of these folks would drop racism or mellow out. So, really, the Blacks who act good reap racist crap that flows from the Blacks that act bad. So Black bad actors essentially create racist oppression for good acting Blacks.
It’s probably humiliating to admit that, but that’s about the size of it.
I agree with tulio that there’s lots of things to like about Blacks. I like a lot of things about Blacks. See, people like me came out of the 1960’s counterculture and Black Liberation was one of the liberations that we were working for. And I must say, I met a lot of Black hippies and Black cool cats and they sure were easy to get along with!
We were all part of a social revolution and when they noticed you were a hippie too, they saw you as a brother. They were not so into this grievance thing. To us, White racism was part of the oppressive White culture (the older generation) that we were rebelling against. It wasn’t hip or cool or any of that. And that’s still what drives me in a lot of ways.
It’s true that there are a lot of bad Black actors, but why is it somehow my responsibility to deal with that? What can I do to fix mass fatherlessness in the Black community, for example?
Do you, as a White person, feel any obligation to go to pockets of White poverty or dysfunction and “do something about it”?
I’m interested in Black pathology. I do read about it quite a bit. There’s always something new going on.
For instance, lately, there is the “flash mob” phenomenon. Blacks have taken up the “flash mob” thing created by Whites and turned it into something pretty bad. Sure, it’s poor inner city Blacks doing it, but I think it’s interesting. I hadn’t heard of it before.
I recently heard from many waiters and waitresses that Blacks are notorious in the industry for being horrible tippers, when they tip at all. What’s up with Black people and why don’t they tip? That’s standard civilized behavior in White society – you leave a tip. We even sit around and do math in our heads afterwards to figure out how much. Not tipping is unfathomable to us.
I talked to a friend of mine on the phone recently who works for the US government. She told me she didn’t like Blacks all that much. I asked her why and she went on. Many of the Blacks she works with are flat out lazy, won’t do their jobs, always show up late, leave early, abuse their sick days and time off, on and on. She often has to do their work for them. Further, they are unfireable due to government protections and also a tendency to scream racism. We have all heard these stories before.
Now, this is a good person. I don’t think she is some evil racist. She’s been driven into this mindset by these Black idiots she works with.
I find it interesting to have these conversations because I always learn something new. Plus I want to see exactly how Blacks are fucking up. These Blacks like the ones in her office are creating racism that comes down on all the rest of them, so Blacks ought to be concerned about it too.
Tell the truth, though, I get tired about reading about Black people acting bad because it seems like I’ve read so much of this stuff a million times. But I always like to hear something new.
I’m interested in how Blacks are screwing up, possibly why and for sure what can we do about it. I’m not interested in learning about it so can have more reasons to hate them.
What would you recommend, for starters, Robert?
It isn’t your responsibility, but it might be something you want to take up to better your own life.
Anyway, since you are part of the Black Women’s Empowerment Movement online, and one of the themes of this group is Black self-improvement, aren’t you already doing that?
White people screwing up doesn’t come down on me, but I do work to help poor Whites. I send lots of political emails to government people and my Congressman and I sign lots of petitions.
I don’t know.
I think the Black community needs to police itself better and have better values. It lacks good values.
As an example, those women in the office where my friend works. Wow, let me tell you, if I acted that way! In my White society, the people I run with and know…I mean, if I come in late, leave early, refuse to do my work and make others do my work for me, abuse my sick time, etc. What I am is irresponsible and especially LAZY! In my White society, being irresponsible and especially lazy in life or at work is nearly unforgivable.
My society is very workaholic and responsible. And one thing they hate more than anything else is laziness and refusal to work. If I got fired for being irresponsible and lazy, Whites would just say I deserved it and say, “Screw you! No sympathy!”
Now, I have lazy tendencies like anyone else, and I can be irresponsible, but I’ve been trained well. When I have a job that I like, I show up *early*, like 15 minutes early, every single day. And I even have tendencies to stay late. In fact, my fellow workers often hate me because I won’t clear out quickly enough.
And it’s deeply shameful to me to be irresponsible at work or do poor work. That’s terrible. What if I got written up or fired for “poor work.” Wow! In White society, that’s really humiliating!
I think that White society is way too workaholic and anti-lazy and anti-irresponsible (they seem like prigs) but that’s the society that I live in, and I’ve incorporated its values.
But in Black society, it seems like it doesn’t work like that. Someone who is lazy or irresponsible at work will not receive mass condemnation. Instead, it seems like they will be supported and even coddled. That seems so wrong and alien to us Whites that I can’t put it into words.
The women who have been working for black women’s empowerment, as it is called, deserve all the appreciation and respect in the world for what they do, each one of them.
As far as the subject here goes, I’m not sure what further study of Black behavior is going to yield.
There is a lot of truth to what you’re saying here. I read Dinesh D’Souza’s book, The End of Racism and your paragraph above sums up his 700 page work. I think the ghetto pathology culture does cause a lot of racism, or at least intensify what’s already there. However, I do think there’s a general white racism/privilege that is independent of how blacks behave. For example, the right is in siege mentality over everything Obama does and I have a hard time believing his race isn’t playing a role. Through the campaign, I had to see him portrayed as “un-American”, as “Muslim” as “socialist”, right wing commentators playing up his middle name in order to pander to racist that are fearful of his background. I saw whites with racist banners, I know the tea party movement has a lot of racists. I remember right after the election, stormfront was so overloaded with traffic the site was non-functional for about a week. I don’t think a white candidate with the same credentials as Obama would have to put up with all that crap. I saw Michelle portrayed as an angry black woman with a chip on her shoulder, even though nothing I’ve seen of her in public interviews suggest that she fits that stereotype. Now we can’t blame any of this on pathological black behavior. The Obama’s are a shining example of a successful and admirable family in every way. I thought these were the type of blacks that whites feel comfortable around.
The ghetto blacks do make it a hell of a lot worse for us. And not just by proxy of white racist, but directly against it. I had an incident just last night involving a group of thuggish black dudes that could’ve turned ugly if me and my friend didn’t have our wits about us. I’ve talked about this stuff with my black friends too. There is though a white racism that exist regardless of how blacks behave.
This behavior disturbs me, too. I come from a family of hard-working, disciplined Black people who never would have made it had they been lazy and irresponsible!
Robert, your post on black laziness at work is just too anecdotal for me to offer any direct response to what you’ve said. I remember a discussion like this on another forum where black work ethic was discussed and one white guy said he has no problems with his black co-workers(mostly women) being lazy or irresponsible and took offense himself to the stereotypes. So I think experience varies. I can’t say I’ve worked around a large enough number of blacks to have observed much. The only jobs I had where there were blacks other than myself was when I worked in retail as a teen and in my early 20s. I worked at a call center while in college. There was one black manager of the floor who was pretty strict. There were maybe a couple black dudes that fucked off too much. One got fired. But most the blacks did their job and were non-problematic. Particularly the women. My experience overall is that black workers were not problematic. This is all anecdotal of course and different people will see different things depending on what industry they work in, what part of the country they live in, the age category of most the workers, the education and professional status of the workers. There is also a tendency for people to view other through lenses of stereotypes and turn perception into reality. Tim Wise references a fascinating study where whites were shown a video of a black and a white customer service clerk. The control group was shown the black clerk. The actors in the video had the same script and same behavior. The results showed that whites saw the black clerk’s behavior as worse than it actually was in reality. So I’m not saying stereotypes don’t have some basis in reality, but the problem is they become self-reinforcing and start to shape the way we perceive people’s behavior. That’s why I don’t trust anecdotal information on things like black work ethic. I’d love to see a study though that used some objective measures. And btw Robert, I’m in no way discounting what you said, it may be reality for YOU. But that reality may not be the case for the next person, and the stereotype filter complicates people’s objectivity further.
Well, it has not been my experience, actually. But I have not worked with a whole lot of Blacks outside of teaching. In the schools, really, there is no problem with Black teachers, admins, even janitors or whatnot fucking off. Very little. I remember one incompetent Black teacher. I believe he was an alcoholic. But that was about it. Blacks do tend to have a more easy going attitude towards work and I like that since I hate the whole White “work like a monkey on speed” thing. I like to work at a normal, kind of relaxed sort of pace.
I worked with some Blacks at a legal coding place and they were not a problem. I worked with some at the IRS and they worked hard. In fact, they accused me of being slow LOL. At the factory, at the publishing house, at the security guard job, at the messenger service, at the warehouse, the Blacks worked hard and did well.
One thing you do hear over and over is Blacks tending to come in late. That’s a real stereotype and you hear it a lot. I think there is something to it.
At my Mom’s work at the college district she works for there was this one Black woman, well, she was a stereotypical fuckoff Black employee. Came in late, left early, took TONS of time off for little or no good reason and did a lousy job at work too. Well, finally my Mom’s boss fired her ass, and she deserved it, believe me! Then, stereotypically, she filed a grievance with the union claiming racism and it turned into a great big headache.
It’s shit like that that drives Whites up the wall.
I plead guilty to that one. I’m not punctual and punctuality makes me feel constrained. Time to me is always “fuzzy”. Me and my Latino friends joke about it all time, we call it “CPT”, colored people time. It’s pretty common in Latin America too and I believe southern Europe as well where people have a more relaxed attitude on punctuality. I remember renting a jetski in Puerto Vallarta a few years ago. It was for an hour be he said, “that’s an hour in Mexican time” meaning if I bring back late, no biggie. I prefer that sort of relaxed attitude too. I think people tend to associate that with lack of worth ethic, but I don’t think lack of punctuality and lack of work ethic are necessarily the same thing, though they can be in some individuals.
This “coming to work late” thing amazes me. My parents wouldn’t have dared. This just wasn’t the way they operated. I guess I learned from them that if you wanted your job, you came in on time!
Off topic, but theres no need to put my blog on your follow list. Though I think I have some good ideas for the HBD community, doing this isnt worth my prepare for college and future career time.
Im going to try and graduate college in just one year, so im mainly going to be studying that, and only rarely go on the internet. Theres too many people who value degrees and high education over idea quality, I wont have much prestige if I just write on the internet, if I havent already proved my intelligence with accomplishments valued by everyone.
When I do check up on HBD blogs, it will be for ideas for a term paper or a research project or something. I cant just randomly browse them like I do now.
Adios. Keep being boss
Interesting post. However, I have some different explanations.
Many whites focus their venom on blacks because for 13% of the population, blacks are one of the most outspoken and visible groups in the U.S. More than any other group, blacks are constantly denouncing, indicting, criticizing, and making demands of whites. Therefore, rightly or wrongly, many whites see blacks as a thorn in their side.
Yes, I acknowledge that in many aspects of life (education, housing, health care, income, treatment at the hands of the justice system, etc), blacks still lag behind whites. However, no person wants to be around someone who’s hostile and bitter. As a white person, I understand that blacks have every right and reason to hate and resent whites like me. Still, that doesn’t mean I’m going to want to be around those who are perpetually angry with me.
I’m a young Californian UC student whose social group in both middle and high school and college was/is majority non-white (mostly Asian and Hispanic, with a couple of blacks thrown in). Out of all groups, I’ve noticed the greatest bitterness and hostility coming from blacks. Therefore, I find myself harboring negative feelings about blacks.
Just to clarify, I know that blacks are not a monolith. Despite all the Michael Eric Dyson types, most blacks are center right. I also know that many blacks admire Bill Cosby and are more interested in self-improvement than blaming whites. I know that not all blacks are screaming “reparations now!” Unfortunately, the most radical, outspoken blacks like Dyson or Cornel West seem to get all the attention. Therefore, I’ve concluded that many whites don’t like blacks because they’re under the impression that blacks are always blaming them for everything. Of course (as a proud white person, this embarrasses me greatly), another problem is that too many whites follow Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, and Glenn Beck.
That’s my explanation.
Blacks are pretty belligerent and unpleasant in general. A lot of liberal Whites avoid them for that reason. They’re just too much trouble and once you get involved with them, the race card comes out pretty quickly. In White society, you’re supposed to be happy and friendly all the time. If you’re not, you’re shunned. So Blacks are going to be avoided if they are too angry.
“In White society, you’re supposed to be happy and friendly all the time. If you’re not, you’re shunned. So Blacks are going to be avoided if they are too angry.”
This is absolutely true.
One finds themselves (subconsciously) avoiding Blacks because Blacks are often times very negative people in general, especially towards Whites.
These are Urban Blacks.
Rural Blacks are actually polar opposites; very upbeat, like most other Racial/Ethnic groups.
Having grown up with Black people, I wouldn’t say that Blacks are belligerent and unpleasant in general.
They seem that way to us Whites. Maybe they are when they are around us. They seem like they have a chip on their shoulder and are always angry about something. Maybe they act different around us than they act around other Blacks.
Although there are belligerent, unpleasant Black people, I think Whites have the assumption that all Black people are like this, or can quickly become like this.
There are times that Whites have simply assumed that I was angry in a situation – even though not an angry thought had crossed my mind.
Whatever happened to the stereotype of the happy-go-lucky darkie that was ever-grinning widely and pleased to entertain whites? Interesting how perceptions shift.
Most will be cordial enough just to get along with, but most people don’t go out of their way to be cheery from what I observe. I don’t think most blacks are any different, at least in my experience.
I know people from many different ethnicities, I’ve traveled abroad more than your average American, so I’ve experienced a nice swath of humanity both here and abroad. I can say that most people are cool overall. And the way you treat people tends to determine how they treat you back. I don’t think there’s anything unique about black people that makes them particularly nasty or sets them apart from the rest of humanity. Act kind and friendly toward most black people and they will be toward you. Act nasty or condescending to them and they will act that way to you. Isn’t that how it works with most people?
I think what I meant by that is that nowadays a lot of Blacks seem to have a racial chip on their shoulder. This is what we Whites notice when we are dealing with them. They’re always on the lookout for racism and prone to play the race card.
I don’t think Blacks are naturally belligerent or anything. If you go to Black countries, you do find that happy Black stereotype. But here in the US, with racial politics the way it is, a lot of them seem pissed off, at least when they are dealing with us.
But I’ve noticed that the White racists always claim that Blacks are extremely hostile and trying to start something. That has not been my experience. I can get along with even pretty ghetto Blacks just by trying to respect them. It’s sort of hard sometimes, and a lot of them probably don’t deserve my respect, but I try to dish it out anyway, just to get along with them.
I’ve found that if you’re a White person who doesn’t obviously treat them like shit in some way or other, most Blacks seem to appreciate it and are at least polite.
The White racists who complain about Black hostility are all very racist themselves towards Blacks. Isn’t it clear that they are going to be demonstrating that racism towards the Blacks they are in contact with? Unless they are actors and get outside of it to be phony, which I doubt.
My theory is that the extreme hostility that racists always say that they get from Blacks must in part be Blacks picking up on an obviously racist, dicky person and maybe just throwing it back at them.
Most people, on a casual level, if you’re decent and respectful towards them, they will be back at you.
I was referring more to deeper relationships with Blacks, where it seems that they often get into this grudge, chip on their shoulder thing, at least with us Whites.
I see what you’re saying with the clarification. I think too much emphasis has been put on white racism as the cause of black problems and that’s probably what’s causing the attitude you mention.
There was a sort of split off in black thought between Booker T. Washington and W.E.B. DuBois. Washington’s focus was not on white racism but building a self-reliant black race. DuBois would lay focus on civil rights and white oppression and it was his thought that laid the ground for the course of black politics.
I do wish we had more Washington’s to balance things out. We have some, but they are generally not well received by the black community.
Btw, this is turning out to be a great thread. What keeps me coming back to this site, is the honesty of the opinions and the wide variety, from pro-black to pro-white and that we can all discuss this stuff in a civil manner without attacking one another’s characters.
Yeah this is a great site. On a typical anti-racist site, you can’t even talk about stuff like this. A thread like this would be all, “Why evil Whites make up total lies about wonderful, hardworking Blacks and any dissenters would get pummeled.
On a typical race realist site, it would everyone agreeing on why all Black workers suck, and why all Blacks they have worked with were incompetent, lazy, this or that.
But neither of those reflect reality.
I think this site stays cool because I like most non-Whites, so I don’t get too twisted around with emphasizing only negative about them. Plus I’m always guarding against my own racism so my comments are pretty judiciously chosen. And the Blacks on the site are defensive, but not too much, so the real racists get spanked and shut down, but we can still talk real.
It’s amazing how many controversial things you can talk about if you quit drinking the Haterade and playing the race card.
Still the black race, white race junk. I knew that even if there was a black President, it would probably get worse.
Sorry, black people, you have had absolutely zero humility as your chosen one got in there. Everywhere I look, everyone is a racist. The Race card is over done, just like when Jews think everyone is an anti-semite over the smallest things that are miniscule.
I know race-hate and religious hate, but- it is being created now–race-baiting is all over. If you disagree with Obamas far left wing ways, you aint nuttin but a racist.
I am against illegals, probably b/c the city I lived in turned from a gorgeous city into a sanctuary city for illegals and the condoning of their murders.
Wheres the “CHANGE?” I thought the Messiah-Obama was going to change things, nothings changed and its worse.
hmmm… shouldn’t this post not have been made? If WN’s shouldn’t talk about blacks then shouldn’t anti-WN’s not talk about WN’s?
Do you have any data on the breakdown of jewish intelligence?
Since, there seems to be an unproven idea circulating in the HBD osphere that jews have a higher verbal intelligence, relative to analytical intelligence, which is not the same thing as spatial intelligence.
I think that might partially explain the “parasite” stereotype of jews. Being relatively more adept at value transference fields, such as banking and acting, while not having as big as an advantage in fields such as engineering or physical labor, that leads to jews having more wealth than creating it.
That also might explain the phenomena of jews seemingly having “more smarts than sense”
Yes, there is nothing to that. Jews have the typical White verbal -> spatial pattern in their IQ’s. I’ve never heard anything about Jews being comparatively deficient in analytic skills as opposed to verbal.
Other high-IQ also dominated their societies in similar ways. Look at the very high-IQ overseas Chinese and how the dominate in a Jewish-like fashion the much lower IQ SE Asians. Chinese are also accused of being liars, cheats, money-grubbing, etc. That’s all that’s going on with Jews.
well, i dont mean a “deficit”
I mean more of a smaller advantage. All the data I have found is like this
“These studies (see references) also indicate that this advantage is primarily in verbal and mathematical performance; spatial and visual-perceptual performance is average”
I think jews have a higher average analytical intelligence, but not quite so much higher as their verbal intelligence.
That is just the White profile, higher in verbal and lower in visuospatial.
No, see, these tests were normed on white british norms. So there is no “higher” in any field, as the british average is defined as the norm
LOVE IT, LOVE IT, LOVE IT LINDSAY. I LOVE YOUR OBJECTIVE THINKING!
WELL SAID. YOU SHOULD TRANSMIT THIS TO ALL MAJOR NETWORKS!!!!!
Really, you like this? Wow, thx man.
Hi Mali, this also was written by Alpha Unit, my guest author.
But racists have a lot of time to spend on studying a group of people they supposedly dislike and want nothing to do with. Black people are supposed to be innately inferior, right? If so, why do you care why we do what we do? Why would you seek out multiple opportunities to discuss Black behavior and look at videos of Black behavior, and why is Black behavior so fascinating and entertaining to you?
I don’t think this is the way you act toward people you want nothing to do with and cannot stand. So why do you pay so much attention to Blacks? What do you want? – Alpha Unit
My goodness, with all due respect, this seems like some serious projection on your part Alpha Unit, since I think you could just as easily, and realistically say that it is Black racists and ‘haters’ that are consumed and obsessed with what White folks are doing.
To the extent that White ‘racists’ do what you claim they’re doing, its probably has much more to do with the fact that we are forced to deal with unsavory Blacks and other non-Whites, whether we like it or not.
Otherwise, interesting, thought-provoking article, as usual from you.
It’s true that a lot of Black anti-racists and your Black Power and Afrocentrist types are all wrapped up in White people.
Alpha’s post is not so much an indictment of White racism as a note about a tendency of racists in general. They are frequently obsessed with people who they hate. This applies to all racists, and to sexists too. Feminazis hate our guts, and they are obsessed with us guys. Sexist males are obsessed with the bitches that they hate, and can’t quit talking about them.
You’re getting into general psychology or philosophy here. Why are many people obsessed with their enemies, or the people they despise. Indeed, it’s healthier to just blow off those you dislike, but your various -ist professional haters, well, I don’t think they are very healthy people.
Whenever I criticize White racists, people always jump to the conclusion that I’m criticizing White PEOPLE, or the entire White RACE, when I’m clearly not.
Also, I don’t speak for Black racists. Anyone who has a complaint against Black racists needs to go directly to them. I’m not their apologist.
I speak for one person: Alpha Unit.