White Separatists are all White Supremacists because most all WN’s think that Whites are better than all the other races. That’s why they need to separate, discriminate, expel, on and on.
This is also behind the whole fixation on “We are going extinct.” Fact is, ethnic groups and their genetic lines are going extinct all over the world as we speak. It’s always been going on, but the process is pretty accelerated now. Now one much cares. The only thing anyone cares about is preserving their culture and language, but that gets harder as the ethnic group intermarries so much.
No one seems to give a damn about genetic extinction. Why don’t they care? Because none of these groups think their genes are better than everyone else’s genes. Only Whites do. Only WN’s think that their genes are better that the genes of all other humans. This is the impetus behind all WN, White Separatism, neo-Nazism and all that.
White Separatists always like to conflate ethnic separatism with racial separatism. List of ethnic separatists here. Indeed, there have been many ethnic separatist movements all over the world, and some have been successful. But ethnic separatism or national liberation is completely different from racial separatism.
For instance, most ethnic separatists contain a variety of ethnic groups, racial, religious and otherwise, within their separatist nation. There are various genetic lines going in Basques, Kurds and whatnot. If you want to move to the Basque Country or Kurdistan, learn Basque or Kurdish and take up Basque or Kurdish culture, no one is going to stop you. Ethnic separatists care nothing about racial lines or intermarriage as a general rule.
Most are fairly mixed genetically anyway. For instance, the Palestinian nation, a nation seeking national liberation, is made up of all sorts of racial and ethnic stocks. They share a Palestinian culture and speak Palestinian Arabic.
I’m not aware of any ethnic separatists anywhere who oppose marriage outside of the ethnic group other than the Jews. But the Jews have blurred the lines between racial and ethnic separatism in that sense.
Racial separatists are listed here. As you can see, racial separatism and ethnic separatism are totally different. Note that the movements are not successful, and indeed, there has probably never been a successful racial separatist movement anywhere on Earth.
It’s true that there have been some religious separatist groups, and some have been pretty successful. It’s easier to do this because Pakistan is 99% Muslim, so why not make a country?
Gender Separatism is about as whack as racial separatism, if not more so. It’s never worked either, and it never will. There are different types such as Feminist Separatism and Lesbian Separatism.
The difference is that there are some straight women in Feminist Separatism (I guess!) but since they hate men and chicks don’t turn them on, they don’t fuck anyone or anything except maybe themselves and inanimate objects. Similar to racial and sex orientation separatists, these bitches are serious haters. They have formed little separatist communities in the US called “womyn’s lands.”
The reason these LC’s spell “woman” as “womyn” is because the way sane people spell it has that gross word “man” in there stinking up that pretty feminine word. What a bunch of dumb bitches! One of the leaders of this movement is some Jewish chick named Elena Dykewomon. I take it that wasn’t her given name! Notice how the former Elena Nachman spells her name. That icky “man” etymology problem again.
I wonder where they stay when they travel? The YWCA?
Similar, of course, is Queer Separatism. Actually a lot of straights would probably be pretty happy with that one! Queer Separatists are haters too, like all gender, race and sexual orientation separatists, and they get their ideology from the founder of Zionism, Theodor Herzl. One more reason Zionism sucks. It gave birth to a bunch of other hater movements. These dumbasses insist that gays are a nation in need of national liberation and a homeland.
As you can see, all of the racial separatist movements are failing, and it looks like they will always fail.
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I was looking over the Wikipedia article you linked to on separatism. For my money, no one beats the feminist separatists for sheer reality challengedness and craziness. There’s one that’s not even worth considering for a single second. In fact, I’m thinking of suing wikipedia for the loss of the two or three brain cells that will be forever wasted remembering that such a thing exists.
LOL.
Unfortunately being a lesbian feminist separatist seems to be a pre-condition for women to enter into American academia or political life. I don’t know how Mort has trouble remembering they exist – from the amount of airtime they get on the MSM one could get the impression that they were the ‘normal’ modern woman, as indeed they pretend to be, though 99.9999…..% of women loathe them.
I have to quibble ( well, I don’t HAVE to, but what the hell!) some things:
“Only WN’s think that their genes are better that the genes of all other humans. ”
I think the Japs and Chinese have shown decided tendencies that way.
“I’m not aware of any ethnic separatists anywhere who oppose marriage outside of the ethnic group other than the Jews. But the Jews have blurred the lines between racial and ethnic separatism in that sense. … It’s true that there have been some religious separatist groups, and some have been pretty successful. ”
Well, Irish Catholics spring to mind. Like jews, many of them now are non-religious, but still claim to be ‘ethnically catholic’ – you even find a lot of pricks promoting the idea that you’re not ‘celtic’ ( and that’s a very debateable thing in itself) if you’re not catholic. In fact recently a Sinn Fein MP ( you know, the socialist anti-imperialist freedom fighters LOL) publicly stated that the anti-discrimination laws in N. Ireland didn’t apply to immigrant Poles (all catholics)- I can’t remember the details, but she made a case that the law only applied to Irish catholic ethnicity. Really. And of course they still oppose ‘marrying out’. Worse, when it comes to sex, they have the same attitude to that as they do to their traditional music – they don’t feel comfortable doing it with anyone more remote than a first cousin. Benighted inbred bastards. But I’m sure there are plenty more examples scattered round the world.
“… Pakistan is 99% Muslim, so why not make a country?” Well, it is now, and they did.
Ha, I would love to see an actual Queer Nation, with its own borders etc. Has there ever been one? What would it be like? There must be areas of San Francisco that are more than 50% gay.
“And of course (Irish Catholics) still oppose ‘marrying out’.”
Not sure I agree. There’s a long tradition of marriage between catholics of different euro-ethnicities. Eastern US states are full of such couplings. What was Éamon de Valera? A pure boy from Galway?
As for Irish being celtic, what does ‘celtic’ actually that mean? Is it a myth drawn up by 19th century romanticists? I mean there is clearly no ethnic similarity between the dark welsh and the pale scottish.
None? As opposed to an Algerian.
Compare your relative position on this genetic map. It is based on measured of differences in X amounts of ‘microsatelites.’ If you don’t remember this from biology look it up.
http://www.stat.columbia.edu/~cook/movabletype/mlm/from_geo.png
There clearly are differences, but they are relative. So if you are dealing with just Nords and Celts, they are seen as separate (“races”). Toss in Hui and all of the sudden you now have “white” because the differences are so small.
When people in science deny ‘races’ really — I mean if you really ask them what they are saying — they are saying the differences are non-significant.
But that’s a relative thing itself. Compared to God, the differences between me and a genius are non-significant. Are they really — well, that’s more of a philosophical issue, when not strictly practical. But what if the practical difference is that you tend to treat them difference (ie prefer red-headed Irish)– does that count?
RL:”No one seems to give a damn about genetic extinction. Why don’t they care? Because none of these groups think their genes are better than everyone else’s genes. Only Whites do. Only WN’s think that their genes are better that the genes of all other humans.”
Hey Mr. Lindsay…NEWSFLASH! White genes ARE definitely ‘better’ than non-White genes if history in general, White cultural advancement vs. non-White cultural advancement (in terms of science, technology, medicine, art, politics, etc), and the generally advanced level of White civilization compared to non-White civilization is any judge (and it obviously is).
That being said, I am definitely not some crazed and murderous White supremacist who wants to start committing genocide on all non-Whites…hell no. I used to be totally and completely against any whiff of so-called ‘White supremacy’ until I got in racialism and started following the pro-White movement about 2-3 years ago. But the facts about ‘White [genetic] supremacy’ pretty much speak for themselves if you are being totally (even brutally) honest with yourself and others about history and the socio-racial development of humankind; as Alexander Solzhenitsyn once wrote/said: “Live Not By Lies” – http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/solzhenitsyn/livenotbylies.html
I can’t believe that I (as a just-turned 27 year old) must lecture a 50+ year old about this most obvious, basic, and common-sense stuff…the Jewish-brainwashing sure runs deep in you American baby-boomers, that’s for damn sure. It was most likely all that sickening TV emanating from the Jew-infested American mass-media that y’all watched while growing up that messed with your minds so much.
– http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2009/07/22/robert-lindsay-again/#comment-15278
Of course. This is what we all know. You aren’t really worried about “going extinct” just on some existential basis. The extinction that you fear is the dilution of your superior genes with the inferior genes of all of the other groups. This is what drives your thinking. It’s so obvious it’s painful.
You distinguish between a “rule over others” supremacism and a “we are better than everyone else” sense of superiority. Fine, np. But don’t lie to me and say you guys don’t think you’re better than everyone else.
Wait, there is more. If you did NOT feel you are better than everyone else (most of you guys lie and say you don’t) then obviously, you would not give a flying fuck about genetic dilution or interbreeding with other groups and whatnot. And as a matter of fact, most groups of humans do NOT particularly give a fuck about the dilution of their precious genes. Only you do. Because you think your genes are best.
Now that we have gotten this out the way, we can move on to other things.
In a nutshell, this is why I oppose the vast majority of the pro-White movement. The whole damn movement is taken over by ranting lunatics without about 1% popular support. They all think their genes are better than everyone else’s, or, if not, that their culture is better. They all oppose breeding with other (obviously inferior) genetic groups. Most of them are completely insane and want to set up some weird racially separatist state that will never occur in my lifetime, or probably ever.
It’s really sad. Black advocates and Hispanic advocates don’t think their genes are superior and oppose interbreeding with other groups. They do not demand racially separatist states. All they do is advocate for themselves. Why can’t White people just be normal like that?
The superiority gambit is a real problem. I’ve been studying Supremacist movements for some time now. They are ALL just like you guys. They ALL think that they are superior to all other groups of humans on Earth. Why, you ask them? They give the same answer you just did. Because it’s true! And we can prove it. All of these Supremacist groups have gathered reams of data to prove that they are superior to everyone else. They’re just like you, can’t you see that? But if you point out to them that they are all the same, that they can’t possibly all be superior, they will all say what you guys say, “Right, all the others are wrong. They think they are superior but they are not. We are the only superior ones and we have the facts to back it up.”
So, really, all you Supremacists are the same everywhere on Earth, and the more you study it, the more it seems like any Supremacism is as wack and insane as any other. In fact, Supremacism itself looks like a mental illness.
In answer to your question, of course it’s controversial to say that White genes are the best on Earth! Mention that around here and people will just walk away from you or threaten to hit you. You will hardly find one even White person to agree to that. So, yeah, it’s not exactly proven science and the notion is rejected by most Whites.
The mixing of racial and ethnic groups all down through time is the history of our species. You are fighting a war against History and against Nature. Nature wants to mix. The only way to keep people from mixing as their genes allow them to is to set up weird things you guys don’t believe in, called “cultures”.
It’s actually NOT true that everything is genetic. For instance, it’s genetic that we want to breed with other groups. It takes a very strong extragenetic thing called “culture” (which you don’t believe in to the extent that it is extragenetic) to force people to disobey their natural dictates.
That’s why there are cultures out there with prohibitions against outbreeding. They set these cultural edifices up as a form of Social Engineering in order to prevent people from doing what comes natural to them, breeding with other groups.
It’s not all true that every ethnic group on Earth wants to further some weird ethnic genetic interests. The only thing with a genetic interest is the individual. Indeed, on the individual level, we want to pass on our line. But we don’t particularly care about diluting its purity or whatever.
Salter is a big fat fucking liar. If ethnic groups behaved like he did, every race, ethnic group and tribe on Earth would be full of bucktoothed retards out of Deliverance. This is where inbreeding leads – to fucked up genes. Every inbred group on Earth has fucked up genes. There is NOTHING adaptive about inbreeding.
A few comments,
A. “ethnic groups and their genetic lines are going extinct all over the world as we speak..no one much cares.’
You mean..you don’t care.
“In almost all the countries, majorities agreed that environmental protection should be a high priority, “even if it causes slower economic growth and some loss of jobs.” Majorities in most countries surveyed also said that their traditional way of life was being lost. At least half of the respondents in those countries said that their way of life should be protected against foreign influence. A total of more than 45,000 adults were surveyed…… The survey found that immigration concerns remained widespread, with large majorities in nearly every country favoring tougher restrictions.” http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/05/world/05pew.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=loss%20of%20tradition%20globalization&st=cse
B. “Wait, there is more. If you did NOT feel you are better than everyone else (most of you guys lie and say you don’t) then obviously, you would not give a flying fuck about genetic dilution or interbreeding with other groups and whatnot.”
Can you please do some research before you post this nonsense, opposition to inter-group marriage ect. is widely opposed by a number of people because it is seen to weaken the in-group binds. If you are all interested in properly understanding this, conceptual distinctions are needed:
1) Desire for some aspect of ethnic (genes, language, religion, culture, history) cohesion.
Which is pretty common. Here is something on exogamy from an ethic group conflict perspective
http://books.google.com/books?id=1nC8htP6SE4C&pg=PA62&lpg=PA62&dq=exogamy+endogamy+ethnicity%27&source=bl&ots=jwlpi_F6Tc&sig=xgB5st7BaLXHiz4MoPvueOXZAa0&hl=en&ei=Z9hnSrySKNaRtgfWlPGfCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2
Usually it’s summed in peoples mind — the more different I am in one way the less I better be in another. So if I marry Han that thinks this way, since I’m not Hui, let alone Asian, I better pick up some other Han credentials — learn the language, culture ect.
2) focus on genetic relatedness as opposed to other forms. Are you honestly telling me that the above examples have nothing to do with appearance (genes)? You think this guy doesn’t care if I marry his daughter — http://www.badeagle.com/2005/06/21/segregation-equality-and-conviction/
3)WN obsession with genes, genes, genes. Ok, I agree SOME of this is just a cultural meme. What else might it be. Well, European culture is pretty ubiquitous. Anything special about English? What about Christianity? What about Western Marriages? (http://www.seiyaku.com/seiyaku/en/western-wedding.html) Hamburgers?
So what’s left? ‘The Republic’ and looking white. Which would you build an identity on? I call it being a victim of success.
4) The nation things: Take 3 and add what you said about the Turks in China, Palestinians, Kurds, ect.
What I am saying is that groups go extinct genetically all the time. The groups themselves don’t seem to give a flying fuck. It’s happening in Siberia, Latin America, the US, Canada, really, lots of places. Africa, India, you name it. Small groups living in areas where there are lots of bigger groups around start marrying in with the bigger groups.
In the process, they lose their small languages and small cultures and get subsumed into the larger language and culture. People are mourning the loss of languages and cultures but I’ve never heard anyone make a fuss of the loss of some tribal gene line or its marriage into some larger group.
You say Indians care about their gene lines. Why don’t you go ask them? I worked with Indians here in California for a while as an anthropologist. Out of a tribe of 800, there is ONE pureblood left, and conquest occurred a mere 150 years ago. That’s all it took. The Indians don’t seem to care that there are no “pure” ones left. They’re all mixed anyway. Further, even the Indian in them is often all mixed in with various tribes. All the other tribes around here are the same way.
If Indians care so much about their precious tribal genes, they are not doing much to preserve them.
White nationalists don’t care about White culture. If Japanese interbred with us massively and in 300 years the new race was still going to the Opera and reading Plato, you think the WN’s would be happy? Of course not. It’s all about genes with these guys.
The research on opposition to outgroup marriage is that it doesn’t seem to work very well. Sure, some tribes have some strictures like that, but most don’t. Anyway, they have to impose this via culture since the genetic tendency is for some to breed out. And the thing is that people just seem to keep on doing it anyway, no matter how much you try to stop them.
People don’t like mass immigration because it resembles invasion and conquest. All tribes naturally oppose this, and most don’t like to get genetically swamped either. Nevertheless, a vast number of those surveyed who hate immigration probably want to come to the US, and I bet a lot of the women want to marry an American. Opposition to immigration is not equivalent to opposition to marrying out.
“White nationalists don’t care about White culture”
OMG Thank you for saying this, it is so true. Depending on the situation I may or may not care about interbreeding. I think there is a huge difference from people descended from the same group being endogamous and people breeding just to keep up some sense of genetic purity. The reason I’m ok with this is because a LARGE influx of foreigners to an area can change the traditions and culture of an area greatly, particularly on a local level. In order not to be subsumed in to the influx, the people have to stay together and protect the culture. However, if there is a small influx and they’re not culturally dominant I believe that they can be “bred in” to the community and assimilated. Genetic purity has nothing to do with it. White nationalists really piss me off because they don’t mind culturally aliean immigration as long as the aliens are white. I wonder how american culture has changed after the mass immigration of Europeans in the late 1800s and early 1900’s. I honestly wonder if the descendents of English and Dutch colonists looked at the northeast after being swamped by pole, jew, italians, and yes even germans and scandinavians and thought, “Ah yes, these are our people.” I wonder what local traditions and folk songs and the like were lost because because of mass white immigration to the US. (And before anyone bitches at me I am partially descended from this wave so no, I’m not being bigoted.) It frustrates me to hear white nationalists in the US complain about the English complaining about Polish immigraton because English and Poles are fellow whites. It doesn’t matter if english culture is destroyed by pakistanis or poles, if it is destroyed it is gone either way. I hate white nationalists. They are cunts who have no respect for anything but genetics, which is the crudest form of materialism. Fuck them.
“The mixing of racial and ethnic groups all down through time is the history of our species.”
And group-competitions (war, genocide, ect) has not? That’s like saying: since some people want to commit crimes and historically have, we should abolish the penal system and any national/ international law.
We regulate processes. My car is going to die, but I don’t say, ‘eh, so what the heck, and floor it every day.’ Why would you say that about this?
The point is rather that, based on your projection — which is fair — life in the coming future will no longer be structured around ethnic loyalty (or least the genetic aspect of this). That’s a fine point. Or that, you don’t feel this is something to hold onto — say like ‘deaf culture’ opposing a new methods or devices. Those are reasonable points, better to elaborate on them.
Life never was structured around genetic loyalty. This is just a lunatic WN fantasy that these racists made up to justify their racist crap.
Your comparisons of ethnic interbreeding with wars and genocides is disgusting, but it’s typical of you guys. What can I say?
You guys simply don’t make sense. Your project is based on Social Engineering and fighting a war against human nature. Good luck with that, but don’t pretend nature is on your side in this project of yours.
Rob,
“Life never…”
No, it was structured around tribal loyalty. How the focus got put on genes is interesting. That’s why I suggested what I did, about a lack of other aspects. WN are the rootless cosmopolitan of the right. Reading these posts, now, I get why you wrote what you did, ie in response — but as an anthropologist, you should recognize things are not so simple. Its like saying — ‘they’re savages.’
‘Comparision’
As for the comparison, I meant it as a logical one, a reductio ad absurdum. If you want: because, historically, people have always looked after their own family and tribe in the past at the exclusion of others, this is how it is and you shouldn’t try to stop then by making nepotism laws, ect.
The point is your argument against something should not be its has always happened or not, but realistic reasons why, which I mentioned. You can make a much better case and do a much better analysis.
‘nature is on’
Well either life was structured around tribalism or it wasn’t (racial being just a particular type). It was. What’s different now? Well, we have a lot more stuff and a lot less scarcity. So the question is, is ‘our nature’ still tribal during a state of affluence. Your answer is no.
All that said — this is a good point:
“All they do is advocate for themselves. Why can’t White people just be normal like that?”
I tend to look at it as: because ‘whites’ can’t act normal and so advocate — they get extremist. Lid on the hot pot thing. Maybe they are being neurotic/repressed then; but it is one thing to say ‘he yell and gets hysterical because he can’t get what he wants’ and ‘he really just want to piss people off.’ It suggest different solutions also. Hard to say.
‘womyn’ is a new one to me. I usually encounter ‘ wimmen’, ‘ wymmen’ or ‘wimmerns’ ( that last one may just be an eccentricity of Dejan of the obscene and obscure but amusing ‘Cultural Parody Center’). North London, esp Camden (now hymietown) and Islington are crawling with them, especially Labour Party circles. They think they own the place, and have a right to outlaw male sexuality, and of course all the chinless wonder male Trots and assorted lefties bend over and offer their collective ass to them. ” Thou shalt not suffer a witch ( biblical)” and anyone who does doesn’t deserve a penis. I hope that the imminent (and well-deserved) destruction of the Labour party will see the bitches out in the political darkness, weeping and wailing and gnashing their dildoes.
Chuck, why are Gotlanders so distinct on that map?
They’re the proto-germans. I don’t know, but I guess that those are the ones that stayed north and the others went south circa 300-600ad.
So it suggests that the Germans, were more mixed with the slavs and who else are around them — you know less separate.
that doesn’t make sense. the northern swedes on that chart cluster with the norwegians and even the slovenians. are there any other charts which show the gotlanders so far away? i mean, they as are far away from other euros as north africans are from yugoslavians.
Slavs are indeed heavily Germanic in origin, that is why they are so close in any graphs and charts.
Russia itself is named for a tribe of Nordics called ‘The Rus’ who traveled from North Scandinavia to.. oh probably Murmansk and started spreading out from there. That is where hot blonde chicks like Anna Kournikova and Maria Sharapova come from! 🙂
Here’s something to cure that lesbian fetish:
http://www.lodestarquarterly.com/img/people/elanadykewomon.jpg
You’re welcome.
LS, I don’t think the hardcore version of lesbian/feminist separatism is that prevalent. How could it be? It almost precludes living in normal human society. That isn’t to say that male bashing and demonization of male sexuality in particular isn’t the default mode in the media, etc. I certainly *wish* some of these feminists would go off somewhere isolated and raise goats, or whatever. But do you have examples?
henry, that doesn’t explain the gotlander anomaly
Examples – well, Monica Lewinsky springs to mind – all that fuss about a blow job! No though, I don’t know who the lesfem separatists are except for Dworkin, if she still IS one. I don’t read them, but I keep encountering references in leftie/Green papers and websites, even from men but especially from women, to some of these American academic nutjob women as if they were to be taken seriously because they call themselves ‘feminists’. It seems to be de rigeur for left organisations to list feminism as amongst the things they stand for, as if there was an agreed definition of it. This is the problem. Everone supports equal rights for women, but feminism includes a lot of stuff that next to NO-ONE supports, and this stuff seems to be insidiously taking a place in left discourse as if it had a natural and inalienable right to be there – I mean of course all the variants of the assault on the traditional mechanisms of heterosexual social mixing, a divisive and vindictive trend. I think the mechanism for the propagation of this is something like this: the natural desire to see women in power leads to a misplaced reverence for ANY woman in power even Margaret Thatcher or Hilary Clinton (SHE calls herself a feminist), so academic feminists have considerable influence; the right wing think tanks recognise that identity politics is a good divisive counter to class politics, so they promote nutjobs like Dworkin; so the off-the-wall deranged musings of the nutjobs attains respectability and starts to work its way into wider academic life, and starts to attract adherents in ‘women’s groups’ that had previously been concerned with worthwhile things like equal pay, maternity leave…; then the nutty ideas start to attract the nuts – the homely spiteful spinsters who (out of conceit mostly) have never made any effort to be attractive to men and resent men for rejecting them; then ‘normal’ (passably well-adjusted) women are put off and ‘women’s groups’ become spiteful spinster clubs promoting the idea that women are at war with men (rather than with the class enemy) and must deprive men of emotional support; these groups attain mass and become a powerful political pressure group that effectively excludes ‘normal’ women from involvement in politics… This IS separatism; not setting up a new society with no men, but acting in this society as a political force that excludes men and recognises no common interest with them.
The above is the reality of the British Labour party – the women are usually married, which may seem a contradiction, but POLITICALLY , they function as a ‘ women’s movement’, except that it’s a movement which has gone way beyond what most women have any sympathy for.
LS: That makes sense. In the U.S. the feminism became so crazy hardly anyone outside of academia really wants to be identified (publicly) with it. Speaking of crazy, Dworkin is blessedly dead. They probably had to to knock down a wall to get her carcass out of the house.
Ironically, the separatist politics you note–and the belief that women are a permanent, universally separate category from men–is now pretty much a matter of dogma. And in the media, pretty much anything having to do with ordinary people and their lives is all about women, although I think that’s more of a marketing decision. Women buy things, and they’re the ones with the time to consume self-referential media bilge.