God I love diagnosing people.
A young woman friend of mine, college student, told me about a guy she met on Facebook. She said hi on his Facebook page and he responded with this email around Valentine’s Day, even though he had never met her. I read it and then the missives that followed, quickly diagnosed pathological narcissism and told her to run don’t walk the Hell away from this guy.
I must say, this lying snake of a PUA (pick up artist) has one Hell of a pickup line. I don’t like being a lying, devious, snaky bastard just to fool women into fucking you. If you want to have sex with lots of women, go ahead, but you ought to do it fair and square. If you’re really the Alpha Male or The Man With the Golden Jizz, women and girls will just about line up to go out with you and have sex with you anyway.
Why lie to women, tell them you love them, just to get in their pants so you can dump their emotionally wrecked psyches afterward? A woman in love is a passionate and desperate creature. Her feelings are not to be trifled with.
I’ve never told a woman I loved her just to get laid in my life. Why should I? If you’re in love with her, say so. If not, say nothing. Sooner or later, she will start spurting out “I love you!”s anyway, and then you can think up a response. Therapists offices are filled with women who are left emotional wrecks by snakes like this. Women are human too. Why do this to them?
Here is the email he sent her on Valentine’s Day, even though he had never met the woman one time in his life, and all she did was say hi on his Facebook page!
The universe is abundant with random occurrences. Occurrences that, like any other, change our specific course in space-time. So I will alter your path today.
You are the most gorgeous woman I know. Dwarfing the tidaling echoes of my imaginations folly. Crumbling the foundations of the majesty found in the night’s milky starts- to rebuild imperfection into a new and more lovely composition of intricately designed magnitude.
My Dear, You are the Universe’s Sweetest Libretto. It is my pleasure to sing your Litany of Creation.
You know this.
The Earth will spin, and the seasons shall pass, but you will always remain beautiful inside the forever beating heart of humankind. Words fail to paint the prettiest pictures. That which is light contains our flowing colors. Drifting through and through the canvas of motion and time you are that which creates the ineffable wonder beneath the medaling of curious human eyes.
Warm, tickling sun hugging you as you rest in a field of breezy pink grass. Giggling star-pink butterflies flittering around your soul and essence, gently kissing the light-blue flowers in your hair. It is simple to say that your very person makes my heart skip a beat, or easy to describe the exhilarating rush of penetrating emotions that you fill me with…
But I find it exceedingly difficult to portray the glowing Love I see in your every smile. It is impossible to articulate the majestic empires of angels playing gleefully in the colorful pools of your delicate irises. I would change the oceans to ink and the sky to scroll in order to properly relay to all who behold, the epic story of you. Thou art a true goddess.
Women should learn from you. I am quite shocked that, as a whole, the men of this Earth have not become wise enough to adore you for all that you are valued as in Heaven and beyond. Where are the castles and shrines, monuments and emerald palaces erected in your name?
My rage is contained, for every human should kneel to you in prayer. How are you Human? You are unreal. Dreamy. I should take this challenge and create for you a vast and never ending stream of warm, humming affection.
It will be even more gentle than the lightest displacement of the airiest angel as it twirls upon a single perfectly-balanced atom of gold, and far more desirous than the most ravenously passionate desires held by all of humanities trailing generations and those beyond our present point- so as to accommodate you who are infinities upon infinities more graceful than these mortal descriptions.
Before I dream, I lay in silence, and before I am let from this world I see your divine visage- and all that is wrong, inside and out, is surely set right throughout as God has blessed this very existence with the ever-flowing imminence of you, dearest Princess. I am not so selfish as to desire you for myself. Your freedom creates our joy. Knowing that you are beneath this very same sky… is all I will ever need.
Happy Valentines Day ^.^
Unbe – fucking – lievable. And she almost fell for it too. Amazing what a pretty pot full of lies will do to a woman.
She went to his page, called him a liar, a sociopath, a scumbag and a bastard and deleted him. He responded with this appalling display of gargantuan egotism:
For starters I am about to be 21. My full name is XXXXXXX X XXXXXXXXXX. I was born in Germany. That is where I got my nickname “Bear” because I was 13 lbs and the nurses loved me so much they called me “oso” which translates into Bear.
I moved to Georgia after 3 years, then to North Carolina, Freeport Illinois, Chicago, South Carolina, Mableton Georgia, Kennesaw Georgia, Jacksonville, back to Kennesaw, and then to Statesboro for GSU. Right now I am in Ellenwood at my younger brother’s house.
Our father left to the middle east and so I had to come watch my brother since he is 16. It was worth it until my dad lost his mind and brought one of his ex’s here. So my time could have been brutally wasted. So I work and am planning on going back to GSU in the fall.
In my spare time I like to read and learn. I take on topics such as quantum mechanics, algebra, logic, psychology, consciousness, reality and so on. I also have several literary projects I am working on. My biggest goal is becoming incorporated. The state secretary has already recognized me and my two reps as “Earth Leader Corporation”.
The documents are sitting here on my desk but they must be amended and notarized for full filing. Earth Leader is still an infant and may not draw serious income for another year. I also make music. My artist name is “XX XXXXX [Lord of Earth]”. I make all the beats and write all the lyrics myself.
I’m not your classic human archetype in a sense that I am very aware of what’s happening around me. More so than many individuals who tread the Earth to date. My internal workings are steadily shifting and processing information.
So you should know that what I look like is completely awry from my inner world. I have detached my psychology from it’s own self and accepted the various sub-systems at work within the entity that I am. What does that mean? I am not normal.
In the sense of strength and glory I am like some men, but my Love and Romance are newfound. It was a while ago that i figured out the functions for human emotion, the dynamics of the group, the dynamics of the person, and the secret to generating infinite love from within the quantum rip of the mind.
So I am an anomaly here. Somewhat like a hacker. But not in a negative sense. As of now, my greatest desire is to connect with you and transmit the necessary information that will allow us both to become comfortable with one another.
She went back to his Facebook page, added him back and apologized for being such a bitch. His response:
You didn’t come off as a bitch =^_^= I find you very interesting. I often wondered what had become of you since I last heard from you. I’ve been busy.
Working still, a number of fiascos with Georgia Southern. So I don’t know when I’ll start school again. Other than that I have been expanding my mind and soul through rigorous gathering of information. I’m glad to hear that your pudendum is less ominous. Please let me know what is on your mind. Lovingly, I am quite eager to know.
After that, pages and pages babbling on and on about quantum mechanics.
You worked there this Summer? During and a little before summer I worked at Pizza Hut. I often change between jobs because people are afraid of me, assume things about me, or just plain don’t understand me. A lot of the time its because the managers aren’t too bright and I walk all over them in my subtle ways until the tryst is over.
The quest I’m on is really quite simple. I won’t claim to be a genius or a psychopath. For you see all disciplines are interrelated. Science, Philosophy, Proto-Science, Religion and Spirituality all do the same thing.
They offer wisdom and knowledge. Most of it is tangled and incoherent so it needs to be smoothed out. Outside of the personality and the subjective experience there are tiers of communication stacked one on top of the other.
I dx’d him immediately as a pathological narcissist. These guys can have sociopathic tendencies, as many narcissists can. I told her to get the Hell away from him as fast as possible because nothing good can come of any relationship with a pathologically damaged narcissist like this.
These people attract weak people (of which there are untold 100’s of millions if not billions on Earth) who are attracted to their extreme self-confidence and narcissism and wish to suck some of the “narcissistic supply” off the narcissist and displace some of that confidence and self-esteem onto themselves, since they lack it and need it. They often have whole crowds of “groupies” following them around who they play emotional games with constantly as cats toy with mice.
With guys like this, it’s all about dominance and submission. They will frequently attack you, especially if you threaten them. If you ferociously counterattack and put them in their place, they will back down, act submissive and try to deal with you “one egotist / winner to another” or “two winners against the world full of loser / idiot / morons.” If you apologize, agree that they are right and you are wrong, etc., they will see that as submissiveness / weakness and will quickly counteract with extreme agression.
Dealing with clowns like this (I have dealt with many of them) leaves you feeling emotionally raped. You really need to get away from them as quickly as possible and just run them out of your life in every way you can. There’s probably no way to get along with someone like this and no one to be friends with them without getting damaged in some way.
I recently ran across another pathological narcissist. This individual set up business in a far off land as a translation service, where he immediately tried to drive all competing businesses out of business. He spread false rumors about them and filed false charges against them with the corrupt foreign government, and he bribed government officials to raid the competition and shut them all down on fake violations.
He himself operated with no business permit, no license and paid no taxes, apparently bribing corrupt officials to get away with this. He used a number of different aliases and moved between them all the time to where it got to be really hard to figure out just who was who and it took his enemies (He had many!) some time to piece it all together and link them up to one guy. He also set up a fake shell corporation in another corrupt foreign land and had a bank account there under yet another name.
He claimed to speak many different languages (20-30 or so) with varying degrees of proficiency and indeed he seemed to be something of a polyglot. He was also an expert pianist and was not shy about saying so.
As a scholar, he did some pretty good work, though he lacked an advanced degree. He attacked all of the big names in the field where he produced his scholarship and accused them all of knowing nothing and being wrong and out of date.
He claimed to revolutionize the field with several ground breaking discoveries, new ways to write languages, new ways to learn languages, etc. He claimed to have discovered a secret way to learn languages that lets you learn them faster than any other way and set up a business to do that.
The business, like his scholarship, was a desultory affair, and he never seemed to finish any project. He did superb work, but then dropped projects before they were completed as he moved on to new things. He threw huge birthday parties for himself at local clubs which attracted large crowds. Beautiful young women flocked to him like moths to flame.
A visit to a “MySpace” type page showed about 80 beautiful young women residents of the country he lived in as “friends.” He was probably trying to date and screw all of them. He was linked to a beautiful, shady and equally sociopathic foreign female who clung to his shoulder like an ornament as he paraded his trophy around.
She also shifted constantly between ever-changing names and identities, was linked to all of his shady schemes and was widely despised by most who met her.
After destroying all the competition with government raids and shutdowns on fake charges, they quickly ran the business into the ground by treating all of their employees like crap. They hired employees as translators on contingency. They tried to force employees to take very demanding tests before hiring them.
Once hired, they would give the employee a huge job. After they got the work back, he and his female sidekick immediately pronounced it inferior and inadequate, fired the translator, and then refused to pay they, all the while showering him with insults about the inferior quality of the translator’s work. Even if they would have paid them, they only paid about 50% going rate anyway. Many of his employees were well known for the excellent work in the community.
As you might guess, the word about these snakes quickly got out, and after a while, no one would work for them anymore. He then infiltrated translator boards where translators were warning everyone not to work for him.
He appeared under many different constantly shifting names on the boards, having conversations with himself and posing as people who praised him for various things. It was all extremely confusing. At times he would appear on the boards and threaten lawsuits against all translators who were warning people off his work.
He claimed to be able to speak 10 or 15 languages at the same time, being able to quickly shift between different languages and all sorts of accents even in the same sentence. He said he could imitate any accent in any language that he knew, and could even imitate accents of his various “enemies”. He did this during legal conferences with the various folks he was suing and he claimed that it left any opponent baffled, devastated and putty in his hand.
Even in this very corrupt land where lawyers are among the most corrupt of the corrupt, his own attorneys quickly tired of his crap and fired him as a client.
He said that in court or under cross examination he planned to play his weird linguistic mind games to “fake out” the opposing lawyers and the judge. Truth is you try that crap in any decent courtroom, and the judge will toss you behind bars in a heartbeat for contempt of court.
My opinion of these folks is that they are psychos. In general, they often don’t get arrested, but they are always straddling the line between legal and illegal. Morality is for suckers.
The world of business, law (attorneys), politics (especially megalomanic dictators), police and military are full of controlled sociopaths that resemble this guy. The extreme narcissist type of controlled sociopath is particularly common in business, law and politics.
As everything is a means to an end, and only they matter, they can sometimes become dangerous.
Some have few controls and are notorious sociopaths like Ted Bundy.
Others are very controlled but suddenly explode like the famous Jeffrey MacDonald, physician who killed his family. The MacDonald case is fascinating as stunning portrait of pathological narcissism. It’s also a great murder mystery. Fatal Vision, the book about the case by Joe McGinnis, is a riveting read.
MacDonald’s many fans continue to insist he is innocent and their webpage is here. A competing page for the rest of us who know the guy is guilty is here. A burned out fry-brain of a hippie doper named Helena Stoeckley has alternately confessed to the crime and retracted her confession. Anyway, she’s now dead and she’s just a false confessor anyway.
If any of my readers is dealing with someone like this, I urge you to get away from them right now. Learn to spot them and in the future avoid them like the plague.
18 thoughts on “Diagnosis: Pathological Narcissism”
Nothing in the PUA/seduction community literature or mindset really advocates lying to girls and pretending to love them in order to get laid. That’s really a non-PUA tactic.
Recent article on the narcissism epidemic:
Reader, the ‘seduction community’ are all hollow manipulators – ie narcissists. They are generally of the ‘disempowered narcissist’ type, which is a bit similar to the Napoleon (short man) syndrome. They are constantly trying to build personas and exploit other people in order to make up for their lack of self and inability to form real relationships.
I should add that of the two people I know who take the PUA/seduction stuff seriously, one beat up his own mother (and is completely unrepentant), and the other preys on teenagers purely because they are more easy to manipulate (whenever they start to develop their own personalities, he leaves them because they are ‘turning psycho’).
Terry, thank you for these excellent comments. I really want to write more on narcissism, as I am fascinated by it. I don’t think that all PUA’s are hardcore pathological narcissists, but I have known some real narcissists who are bigtime into having lots of sex partners. They go on dating sites, lie and say they want an LTR when they really just want sex, and tear the place up. Whenever women criticize them, they go insane, attack the women verbally or via email. If the women dump them, they go nuts, threaten the woman, call her workplace and try to get her fired from work, call her and email her endlessly, demand to get back together, etc. In short, they turn into full-on raging psycho stalkers. The one guy who I am thinking of now has now been banned from Match.com permanently after many threats to remove him due to endless complaints from women.
Do you have a blog? If not, you are welcome to write stuff on narcissism here.
I’m not averse to the PUA thing as I’m often not getting much these days, so I could use some PUA techniques!
What’s the difference between a disempowered narcissist and any other kind of narcissist?
whoops, please put Cali post in the Terry name…thanks
There are types of narcissists, but these types are often just emotional states that the narcissist moves between…
1. the disempowered narcissist has a vague sense of identity and low self-esteem. (In the public mind, high self-esteem and narcissism are virtually the same, though this is far from true).
This kind of narcissist can be contrasted with
2. the empowered (ruthless, constantly requiring narcissistic supply), and
3. the manipulative (a user of people).
(I think I read about these categories from the Maxwell and Cooper book on narcissism. )
It is thought that the narcissist becomes violent and aggressive when transitioning from a empowered / manipulative state to a disempowered state. Imagine the man behind the curtain in the Wizard of Oz as an axe murderer.
Narcissism is set to rise since there are great deal more ‘enablers’ nowadays (online social networking being a prime example), and also because one of the building blocks of narcissism is having narcissistic parents. However, as the Slate article states, the recession might straighten people out a bit.
I should add that I am a little bit narcissistic in some ways. The irony is that if I were any more of a narcissist, then I wouldn’t be able to recognize it, since complete narcissists have notoriously poor self-awareness.
As for the PUA stuff.. well, we all have tricks. But if nearly 100% of your personality is using other people’s tricks, then who are you pleasing? Yourself, or a simulacrum you have created? It seems like a race to the bottom – the more successful you become, the less YOU you are.
As Robert is a feminist or feminist-sympathizer it is probably all but inevitable he overreaches, broadly (pardon the pun)
i am so into broken minds, they fascinate me. i have a strange little hobby of reading about serial killers and whatnot. please sir can i ave sum more?
If you want to take a look at pathological narcissism,
choose a British Israeli jazz artist. I don’t know his name, but he exhibits all the signs, plus a few others.
The guy above writes terrible prose. If I were a woman, I would only respond to someone who could write.
Really? Do you think he is not just a narcissist, but a pathological narcissist? Wow. That’s one nasty beast, man. I guess it goes with the territory. A lot of hardcore narcissists are talented folks that have achieved a lot in their lives. This of course feeds the narcissism.
Hi, just wanted to say that the weird guy you’re describing in your post is DEFENITELY NOT a PUA. He’s just a sick bastard looking for a someone vulnerable to trick her into bed and I totally agree with you on that. Or maybe he’s someone who genuinely thinks that saying those things will get him somewhere.
I’ve read some of the seduction stuff and there’s a lot of bullshit, self-proclaimed love gurus and negative advice. There is though some stuff that may help you see thing from a different perspective and there’s nothing wrong in trying new stuff for a change. After that, it’s up to you whether you believe it or not.
I won’t declare my love to someone I don’t know because that is lying. Love is something that grows over time and connection with a person. However, if I see a woman I’d like to meet I make no apologies for approaching her and saying the TRUTH: that I saw her, I think she’s cute, and I’d like to know her better. Just being sincere and telling what’s going on in my mind. After that It’s just a natural and real conversation.
That’s my opinion.
Thx Fabian. I totally agree with you. That guy is not a PUA. I don’t mind that seduction community stuff. They are trying to show guys how to feel better about themselves so they can get girls. What’s so bad about that?
Ken, you’re just as pathetic here as you are on any other blogs you post on. Journalist?
Beware of stereotypes based on outward appearances!!!
Some narcissists are breathtakingly arrogant, conceited, boastful, presumptious and full of hubris, but I wouldn’t list this as a red flag of NPD.
In fact, I’ve known a narcissist who would strike you as anything but grandiose, vain and haughty. He kept his immodesty well hidden beneath a cloak of false modesty. A true malignant narcissist is a wolf in sheep’s clothes, a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. The overt grandiosity of the Mr. Hyde part of their personality only comes out behind closed doors. Usually in the form of narcissistic rage.
The problem that i see with narcissistic relationships is that the narcissist is highly adept at mirroring the other person (or partner) to such a degree that we falsely assume we SHARE the same values. We will SEE what the narcissist wants us to SEE (this is called projective identification).
Which means that if we are church-going, bible believing people, the narcissist will have a sudden conversion. Why not? Narcissists are accomplished actors and one role is as good as another as long as the Supply (attention) is adequate.
If we are family-oriented and gift the narcissist with a good name and respect, then the narcissist will dot every ‘i’ and cross every ‘t’ to make sure we SEE what we expect to SEE.
Few people remain in narcissistic relationships once the N’s cover has been blown. It may take awhile to stand firm in reality because we yearn for the person we believed him or her to be. The person THEY pretended to be.
So to state that they attract weak people is a mistake, they don’t want be anywhere near ‘weak’ people. They do have a pathological urge though to chip away at anybody’s self esteem with manipulative, subtle, psychological / verbal abuse. They are hollow and mean monsters. The devil in disguise. Never underestimate them.
Isn’t it possible that all human beings are neurotic in some way or another?
One’s a narcissist, the other is self-loathing. One is gullible, the other trusts nobody.
Are some minds broken, or do all minds work in very different ways? I’m sorry, but I don’t think I’ve ever met someone who didn’t have their own psychoses.
The narcissist is a profoundly disturbed human being. It’s maladaptive, and it’s also immoral. I’d go so far as to say that they are a bit evil. They are seriously fucked in the head.
All of us have disordered personalities to one degree or another. But some are less disordered, and others are more disordered. The objective is to be as healthy as possible, not as unhealthy as possible. The narcissist is one sick puppy.
not all narcissists are like this you know… I am a diagnosed pathological narcissist with sociopathic tendencies and I would never do that to a woman sure Ive had plenty of casual relationships but all of them have been casual from the start I have never lied to a woman by telling her I love her I also dont pick out weak women I try to avoid weak people in general as potential mates I would much rather have a powerfull woman who knows what she wants I love the whole “two egoists/winners against the world” thing that is an ideal relationship for me
I have trouble with empathy and guilt and am a kleptomaniac I cannot resist stealing a pack of gum from a store even though I know I could EASILY buy out the whole store with the money I make I have only been arrested once and it was in the fourth grade for attacking my principal (I was on ADHD medication and it made me really violent I think it was either aderall or ritalin) I had violent tendencies as a kid but by the age of 14 I mellowed out and went to some anger management classes and now I only lash out at people verbally I still have ADHD but every med I tried taking either made me more hyper and violent or drowsy so I basically have to live with it… its not that bad really like narcissism it has its perks I only sleep 6-7 hours a day and am never tired
I do tend to be a bit of a shark in the buisness world and used to be a con man and kleptomaniac but I only robbed/scammed people who seemed well off not for any moral reason mind you I figured I would get more if I scammed the rich folks anyways I used to change jobs frequently finding alot of them to be boring after the first year or two I have been into many jobs I had a job as a car salesman and another as a real estate agent right now Im a stockbroker… in general I try to find jobs that involve selling things to people because… in effect that is my talent convincing people they need something I can be very manipulative but generally I try not to be with the people I am close to I am what you call an empowered narcissist I have a bit of a superiority complex and maybe even a god complex anyway I am practically MADE of hubris I always feel confident and entitled to the point where you cannot help but notice me
I am a “love me or hate me” type of person my overconfidence either makes people love me and trust me to lead them or makes them foam at the mouth if I am in a room unless I make a conscious effort to not be noticed YOU WILL NOTICE ME I tend to dominate discussions and am a bit of a power whore… in fact Im kind of a megalomaniac for a time I actually realistically thought I could rule the world (I still want to I just know its impossible) I even had an ultra elaborate plan involving cornering the market in oil and corrupting the worlds goverments from within it was all a fantasy though as much as I want it I would never wield such power
think what you want of me I am who I am there is no changing a narcissist I am uncurable and really who am I kidding I wouldnt have it any other way I love being a narcissist I am free to do what I want without feeling bad about it and provided I stay on the right side of the law or find a way around it or simply not get caught I. CAN. DO. ANYTHING.